culture, religion and language

[zeusbheld]

i specifically don't care about other people's religious beliefs until they try to impose their beliefs on me, in which case their behavior pisses me off.

[CiaranM]

Well, let's look at the Koran, seeing as Islam seems to be the focus of discussion.

There seems to be little doubt that it was Muhammad, a man, who dictated the Koran.

Muhammad says it is the word of G-d.

But there is no proof that I can see of that. Maybe it is true. That is a matter of faith.

The only evidence that appears to exist is that a man recited this.

So if we are going to get into the prove it game, then the onus is on religion to prove it is anything other than man made.

:wink:

Lo was merely stating fact. While empirical evidence agres with what you say, can we with all certainty deny there is anything more to it??

Religion has always been a construct of man's fears, superstitions, hopes and dreams.

Am not saying there is 'anything' out there, but in the tradition of hedging ones bets, I am not refuting it either.

(mind you, if there is a hell, am on a one way ticket :wink: )

as far as i'm concerned it's up to the god botherers to prove he exists !!!

they haven't managed to do it so far .... so they can f**k off and leave me alone !!!

[Kitschiguy]

Let's do a straw poll - who amongst us has religion? What denomination are you?

I was raised a Christian and later left the church after I found it posed more questions than it answered.

For a long time I was an atheist.... then I became an agnostic.

Now I find I WANT to believe in something... I look around the world, at all the incredible diversity and wonder if it can all be the product of evolution.

Wouldn't it be great to discover there really IS someone taking care of us? That there IS a purpose to our lives and that after death we will be together again with loved ones?

How about the TFers on here? What do you believe in?

I like this one. Some of the most interesting debates I've had on the philosophy of religion have stemmed from notions such as this. Many simply regard this as atheism as opposed to anti-theism, or NOT wanting there to be a God.

I was brought up as a Christian (Church of England) although my parents weren't particularly religious - my dad is a staunch atheist. It just turned out that the school I went to was C of E.

I never felt I belonged to the church and can't ever remember a time when I believed in God. By the time I was about 10 I started to actively rebel against religion in school. I've studied theology from a secular point of view (philosophy of religion) so feel I understand some of the philosophical points especially in Buddhism, Confucianism etc but I don't believe in any kind of Judeo-Christian/Abrahamic dogma - a question of faith, obviously, of which I have absolutely non whatsoever.

Personally, I would be mortified to discover that there is a God. To submit myself to the control of God completely, which in the Christian sense it would mean since the bible states that God is omnipotent, omni benevolent and omniscient, would be horrific. Although theologians usually play the 'free will' card but the arguments develop inconsistencies and fall apart fairly quickly. It's because of these fundamental flaws that I became so completely against Christianity. Not to mention the fact that everything I'd ever written or said would be wasted.

[Kitschiguy]

Well, let's look at the Koran, seeing as Islam seems to be the focus of discussion.

There seems to be little doubt that it was Muhammad, a man, who dictated the Koran.

Muhammad says it is the word of G-d.

But there is no proof that I can see of that. Maybe it is true. That is a matter of faith.

The only evidence that appears to exist is that a man recited this.

So if we are going to get into the prove it game, then the onus is on religion to prove it is anything other than man made.

:wink:

Not strictly true - it was the Archangel Gabriel who is supposed to have revealed the word of God to Muhammad, which in my opinion makes it even less likely to have happened. In short, if you believe that, you'd believe anything. It is indeed a question of faith.

Muslims also believe that Gabriel accompanied Muhammad on his celestial jolly to heaven before coming back in time for a bit of Ramadan on the night the Qu'ran was firs revealed.

All makes sense now, doesn't it?

Lord, give me strength! How ironic!!

[eagle]

Well, let's look at the Koran, seeing as Islam seems to be the focus of discussion.

There seems to be little doubt that it was Muhammad, a man, who dictated the Koran.

Muhammad says it is the word of G-d.

But there is no proof that I can see of that. Maybe it is true. That is a matter of faith.

The only evidence that appears to exist is that a man recited this.

So if we are going to get into the prove it game, then the onus is on religion to prove it is anything other than man made.

:wink:

Not strictly true - it was the Archangel Gabriel who is supposed to have revealed the word of God to Muhammad, which in my opinion makes it even less likely to have happened. In short, if you believe that, you'd believe anything. It is indeed a question of faith.

Muslims also believe that Gabriel accompanied Muhammad on his celestial jolly to heaven before coming back in time for a bit of Ramadan on the night the Qu'ran was firs revealed.

All makes sense now, doesn't it?

Lord, give me strength! How ironic!!

and which lord would that be [-(

[zeusbheld]

Well, let's look at the Koran, seeing as Islam seems to be the focus of discussion.

There seems to be little doubt that it was Muhammad, a man, who dictated the Koran.

Muhammad says it is the word of G-d.

But there is no proof that I can see of that. Maybe it is true. That is a matter of faith.

The only evidence that appears to exist is that a man recited this.

So if we are going to get into the prove it game, then the onus is on religion to prove it is anything other than man made.

:wink:

Not strictly true - it was the Archangel Gabriel who is supposed to have revealed the word of God to Muhammad, which in my opinion makes it even less likely to have happened. In short, if you believe that, you'd believe anything. It is indeed a question of faith.

Muslims also believe that Gabriel accompanied Muhammad on his celestial jolly to heaven before coming back in time for a bit of Ramadan on the night the Qu'ran was firs revealed.

All makes sense now, doesn't it?

Lord, give me strength! How ironic!!

and which lord would that be [-(

make mine Dionysius (and yes, i treat my body like a temple).

[Stramash]

Well, let's look at the Koran, seeing as Islam seems to be the focus of discussion.

There seems to be little doubt that it was Muhammad, a man, who dictated the Koran.

Muhammad says it is the word of G-d.

But there is no proof that I can see of that. Maybe it is true. That is a matter of faith.

The only evidence that appears to exist is that a man recited this.

So if we are going to get into the prove it game, then the onus is on religion to prove it is anything other than man made.

:wink:

Not strictly true - it was the Archangel Gabriel who is supposed to have revealed the word of God to Muhammad, which in my opinion makes it even less likely to have happened. In short, if you believe that, you'd believe anything. It is indeed a question of faith.

Muslims also believe that Gabriel accompanied Muhammad on his celestial jolly to heaven before coming back in time for a bit of Ramadan on the night the Qu'ran was firs revealed.

All makes sense now, doesn't it?

Lord, give me strength! How ironic!!

and which lord would that be [-(

make mine Dionysius (and yes, i treat my body like a temple).

but only mon to thursday; friday to sunday it's an amusement park...

[eagle]

Well, let's look at the Koran, seeing as Islam seems to be the focus of discussion.

There seems to be little doubt that it was Muhammad, a man, who dictated the Koran.

Muhammad says it is the word of G-d.

But there is no proof that I can see of that. Maybe it is true. That is a matter of faith.

The only evidence that appears to exist is that a man recited this.

So if we are going to get into the prove it game, then the onus is on religion to prove it is anything other than man made.

:wink:

Not strictly true - it was the Archangel Gabriel who is supposed to have revealed the word of God to Muhammad, which in my opinion makes it even less likely to have happened. In short, if you believe that, you'd believe anything. It is indeed a question of faith.

Muslims also believe that Gabriel accompanied Muhammad on his celestial jolly to heaven before coming back in time for a bit of Ramadan on the night the Qu'ran was firs revealed.

All makes sense now, doesn't it?

Lord, give me strength! How ironic!!

and which lord would that be [-(

make mine Dionysius (and yes, i treat my body like a temple).

that would be lord pour me some wine right :?:

[Mazzy]

Well, let's look at the Koran, seeing as Islam seems to be the focus of discussion.

There seems to be little doubt that it was Muhammad, a man, who dictated the Koran.

Muhammad says it is the word of G-d.

But there is no proof that I can see of that. Maybe it is true. That is a matter of faith.

The only evidence that appears to exist is that a man recited this.

So if we are going to get into the prove it game, then the onus is on religion to prove it is anything other than man made.

:wink:

Not strictly true - it was the Archangel Gabriel who is supposed to have revealed the word of God to Muhammad, which in my opinion makes it even less likely to have happened. In short, if you believe that, you'd believe anything. It is indeed a question of faith.

Muslims also believe that Gabriel accompanied Muhammad on his celestial jolly to heaven before coming back in time for a bit of Ramadan on the night the Qu'ran was firs revealed.

All makes sense now, doesn't it?

Lord, give me strength! How ironic!!

and which lord would that be [-(

make mine Dionysius (and yes, i treat my body like a temple).

but only mon to thursday; friday to sunday it's an amusement park...

Incidentally, he was also known has the inspirer of ritual madness and ecstasy and celebrated in the greek Bacchanalia festival (an all girl wild orgy, I suspect) Nerdy MaZzy 8)