birdtongchai Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 I am all FOR reducing co2 gasses and cut down on emissions, but... VERY recently they have discovered that: The icecap on the South pole has grown significantly, in fact, it has grown more than the loss of ice at the North Pole... IF all the ice on the Northpole would melt, sea levels would FALL instead of rise... How? There is more ice underwater than there is above water. Frozen water takes up more space than liquid water. So if all the frozen water UNDER sea-level melts, it would take up less space. And if the ice above water melts too, all together it would still take up less space than it does now underwater.. The result of this is that sea-levels go down instead of rise.... This combined with the increase of ice on the south pole puts a whole new light on the "rising of the sea" problems... It doesn't counteract the global warming, but I am starting to believe that this might be a natural phenomenon... The earth rotates on its own axis once every 24 hours... and once on it's other axis about once every 365.25 days... this creates day and night, and the 4 seasons... BUT it also VERY VERY slowly rotates on its 3rd axis... Meaning it is no longer on the same angle towards the sun (around 26 degree angle), so the northpole is more directly exposed to the sun, and all other countries are also exposed to the sun on a differnt angle... This explains why some countries get hotter every year, but also why some countries get colder (you don't hear them about those!) and it also explains why there seems to be a small shift in seasons... They seem to start a bit earlier gradually.... Any thoughts? http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/04/23/2550456.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagle Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 It sounds right when you say it like that but when I hear that the majority of scientist think we are in for a rough ride I tend to believe them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdtongchai Posted April 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 Yes, so did I, but what I said about the increase of ice on the southpole has been discovered less than a week ago... The ice on the Northside of the Southpole is melting, but on the Other side of the Southpole it has grown much more! Northpole is still melting... no news on that.... :shock: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagle Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 I'm more concerned with the plight of the ocean these days. Over fishing and dumping trash and toxic waste legally and illegally are quickly making the ocean a dead zone. And the earths fresh water supply is being siphoned out of the earths aquifers by Nestle and Coke at a rate that is hastening a huge water crisis in my opinion. Greedy slobs have inherited the earth. no wait not inheriting but Buying the earth :shock: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loburt Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 I am all FOR reducing co2 gasses and cut down on emissions, but...VERY recently they have discovered that: And who would "they" be? You can't really expect anyone besides people who think they can learn about science and other serious issues by trolling web forums on dating websites to take an alleged scientific discovery seriously when you can only attribute it to "they." Please post a link to your source so others can judge whether or not it's credible. I"ll bet it's not credible. The earth rotates on its own axis once every 24 hours... and once on it's other axis about once every 365.25 days... this creates day and night, and the 4 seasons... BUT it also VERY VERY slowly rotates on its 3rd axis... Meaning it is no longer on the same angle towards the sun (around 26 degree angle), so the northpole is more directly exposed to the sun, and all other countries are also exposed to the sun on a differnt angle... This explains why some countries get hotter every year, but also why some countries get colder (you don't hear them about those!) and it also explains why there seems to be a small shift in seasons... They seem to start a bit earlier gradually.... Any thoughts? The fact that the sun's axis rotates every 26,000 years is something I learned in the 5th grade. So I can just see all those scientists who have won Nobels and other prizes and spent decades researching and studying global warming getting together at their next major international conference, looking each other in the eye, slapping themselves on their foreheads and exclaiming... "D'oh!!! How could we have forgotten about that?!" Please. Come on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
primetime Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 The good things coming out of the global warming is countries are beginning to cut their dependence on oil and they are decreasing pollution. Is global warming a hoax or not....not sure, but if it isn't it surely is not unexpected. Over the history of the world the earth has cooled and warmed up many times. That is why there was an ice age (earth cooled down) and why the ice age ended (earth warmed up). The three big questions are 1. Is the earth warming now or is this time frame just too short to tell if it is just noise or not. 2. If the earth is warming, will the earth warm enough to hurt human population or not. 3. If the earth is warming, what caused it and can it be curtailed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdtongchai Posted April 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 "They" are not people from a dating website or "some" forum. ABC News..... http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/04/23/2550456.htm They are... The British Antarctic Survey combined with NASA... Credible enough? I didn't say that everybody is stupid and that the cause of all this is the rotation of the earth. I just stated this fact, and that it seems to make sense to me. Explains TO ME perfectly why the north part of the southpole is melting and the south part isn't.... The different angle towards the sun explains that TO ME.... What part isn't logical to that? I totally agree that there must be another explanation because it's so simple that all the scientiests must have thought of that, but for educational purposes, where am I wrong? why can't it be the angle? Just because you don't hear the scientists about it? Easy to state that I am dumb or stupid, but what source do you have or knowledge do you have to say that it ISN'T so? Not bashing, i'm just interrested what you guys think about all this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loburt Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 From the same news source three days earlier: http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/04/20/2547067.htm New research has found that despite climate change concerns, the amount of ice may actually be increasing across much of Antarctica. Ian Allison, head of the Australian Antarctic Division's ice, ocean, atmosphere and climate program, says outside of western Antarctica, ice levels are remaining steady or possibly increasing. "Over most of Antarctica the surface temperatures are very well below the freezing point," he said. "So it requires more than a slight warming before you start getting significant melt. "In east Antarctica there may be a slight increase due to increased snow fall." But Dr Allison says overall, ice levels are still falling. "In west Antarctica, the smaller bit that hangs off the tail going up towards the Antarctic peninsula, some of the very large glaciers have increased their speed and are discharging more ice into the atmosphere," he said. "On average, west Antarctica is losing more ice than the east is gaining." *** The story you posted: But it seems that global warming may actually be leading to an increase in sea ice in parts of the Antarctic. **** Not overall. This guy's study vs. that guy's study. And yet if you read the story you posted, even those scientists say their claimed gains in antarctic sea ice are "insignificant." And, as you've acknowledged, certainly not enough to offset the melting of the arctic ice cap. Nowhere in the report on the study you posted do the scientists claim their findings refute global warming. Nowhere. Please read what you posted. In a discussion of science, it doesn't matter if something explains something TO YOU, if it still isn't right. 2+2=8 TO YOU, doesn't make it so. I didn't use the words "dumb" or "stupid." You wrote those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdtongchai Posted April 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 I have doubts on replying again on the topic i started myself... Why does everything so easily start to become hostile? People slapping eachother around the ears with "i didn't say this, I didn't say that". No matter what I will reply now it will be compared word by word with previous postings in the article.. Guys, this is a forum, a place to talk about ****, a place to discuss stuff, not a place where scientists researcher gather and meet. I just posted about something that has my interrest. I read an article about increase of ice on the antarctic. That's all. I want your opinion about that. That's it... In the article all that is being said is there is increase of ice overthere. I didn't insinuate or ment to say that the article says that global warming is a hoax. About I didn't use the words DUMB or STUPID... You are right... you didn't write them.... You are telling me that the things that I state you have learned already in the 5th grade, insinuating that I didn't. Stating that I think that I have thought of something that all the nobel and other prize winners haven't thought of.. and your closing lines......D'oh!!! Please. Come on... How should i read that then? Nevermind... If you have a contribution to the opening post, or an opinion please post... If not, please don't.... friends? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodKarma Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 all I know if you put ice cubes or a big block of ice in a tub of hot water and measured the the liquid amount when the ice melted you would have more water in the tub than before the block was put in. I believe these scientist go by satellite images which every part of the earth is photgraphed by the way just visit google earth go outside of your condo or house and waive up at the sky and a few hours later look up your address. and you will see that it is. some people in various parts of the world struggle to get a clean glass of water.not a can of beer or soda but something natural as water. just think about this the next time you take a long enjoyable hot shower. its all harmonious you know when you step on a ant you interupt the natural nature machine all organisms depend on each other...probably using this computer and writing this forum is probably interupting some natural selection...we only think of these things on earth day and the rest of the year we go back to wasting and our old ways...I know I will.. oh yea did I say happy earth day.. have a great weekend all.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loburt Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 Guys, this is a forum, a place to talk about sh*t, a place to discuss stuff, not a place where scientists researcher gather and meet. ... I didn't insinuate or ment to say that the article says that global warming is a hoax. Nevermind... If you have a contribution to the opening post, or an opinion please post... If not, please don't.... friends? So you want a discussion about the most important scientific issue facing the planet, but you don't want scientists or researchers taking part (not that am one), or science and research brought into it. Interesting ground rules. The title of your thread is "Global warming, just a hoax?" I posted an opinion about your original post already. You just seem to be upset that I'm not agreeing with the content of your post. No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdtongchai Posted April 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 Ok, let's see if after 5 years i can score a card.... You're an ASS... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 It doesn't counteract the global warming, but I am starting to believe that this might be a natural phenomenon... The earth rotates on its own axis once every 24 hours... and once on it's other axis about once every 365.25 days... this creates day and night, and the 4 seasons... BUT it also VERY VERY slowly rotates on its 3rd axis... Meaning it is no longer on the same angle towards the sun (around 26 degree angle), so the northpole is more directly exposed to the sun, and all other countries are also exposed to the sun on a differnt angle... This explains why some countries get hotter every year, but also why some countries get colder (you don't hear them about those!) and it also explains why there seems to be a small shift in seasons... They seem to start a bit earlier gradually.... Any thoughts? Sorry but that's un-scientific twaddle. There is no mysterious 3rd axis. The Earth rotates about it's axis and the sun. That's two. Yes there are long term climate variations, and guess what, climate scientists already know about them. Here's a fact you can take to the bank: most climate scientists agree not only on the existence of global warming but that it is 90% likely that it's caused by us. Posting something that does not couter the existence of global warming under "Global Warming, just a hoax?" is called trolling. Trolls get flamed. Suck it up buddy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdtongchai Posted April 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 Huh? I didn't state anything! Did you notice the "?" behind the word HOAX ? it means that it's not a FACT Gee, what's up with all this, I suddenly remember why i never post in forums... Bye again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vbroker Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 I am all FOR reducing co2 gasses and cut down on emissions, but...VERY recently they have discovered that: And who would "they" be? Moveon.org maybe? Your new employer perhaps? You can't really expect anyone besides people who think they can learn about science and other serious issues by trolling web forums on dating websites to take an alleged scientific discovery seriously when you can only attribute it to "they." Yeah you're right. This is an issue that has been monopolized and thoroughly exploited by the left wing psychos that need a quick and aggressive profile adjustment. I"ll bet it's not credible. Wow. Right again. The hard left dipshits are rarely credible. The fact that the sun's axis rotates every 26,000 years is something I learned in the 5th grade. So I can just see all those scientists who have won Nobels and other prizes and spent decades researching and studying global warming getting together at their next major international conference, looking each other in the eye, slapping themselves on their foreheads and exclaiming..."D'oh!!! How could we have forgotten about that?!" Please. Come on. You mean you can just see "scientists" like Nobel winner AL Gore who spent decades researching and studying Global Warming? Please. Come on. Here's to forgetting about THAT. Ok, let's see if after 5 years i can score a card....You're an a*s... Yes he is. But it's not his fault. He's under the liberal ether. That's a drug more powerful than mainline heroin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Count_Jason Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loburt Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 Yes he is. But it's not his fault. He's under the liberal ether. That's a drug more powerful than mainline heroin. Oh, look who's back. The necon sex tourist. How are the room rates now at that flea bag short time hotel on Nana you stay at? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdtongchai Posted April 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 ON TOPIC PLEASE... thank you.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
English_Bob Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 I don't think Global Warming is a hoax.... But I think it's part of a natural cycle. The earth has been warming for 6000 years. I don't believe mankind is to blame. However, being Machiavellian about the whole thing, if it cuts our dependence on fossil fuels, pollution and starts people thinking greener thoughts, I am all in favour. Just don't expect me to start feeling guilty about using my aircon or flying home to see my family. On a side note (but slightly related), I heard how sea levels are supposed to be rising (but I'm not sure it's proven yet). My question is this, "Is there any measurement of eroded materials being washed into the sea?" Surely there are thousands of tons of sand, silt and crap arriving every day - doesn't that displace a huge volume of water? I think we should nuke the polyps for building all those thousands of kilometres of coral under water and threatening our shorelines... bastards! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdtongchai Posted April 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 Good point, there is a lot of land won from the sea, and projects like the palm tree island in dubai, but i am not sure if all those projects combined could make the sealevel rise on a global level.... i have no clue how many liters of water the combined oceans have, and how much is needed to make it all rise for lets say 3 feet? I think some people mentioned that the sea levels were rising several feet, how much water are we talking about ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 WTF are you guys talking about? There's probably no-one contributing to this thread who is actually a climatologist. Ok I'll make it easy for you... The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) concludes that anthropogenic greenhouse gases are responsible for most of the observed temperature increase since the middle of the twentieth century, and that natural phenomena such as solar variation and volcanoes probably had a small warming effect from pre-industrial times to 1950 and a small cooling effect afterward. These basic conclusions have been endorsed by more than 40 scientific societies and academies of science, including all of the national academies of science of the major industrialized countries. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_warming .... there. That's what the experts think after lifetimes of studying the situation. It's happening and it's our fault. Look it up if you want. Now we can all go back to trawling for porn and posting about Cherie's sexual activities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
English_Bob Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 WTF are you guys talking about? There's probably no-one contributing to this thread who is actually a climatologist.Ok I'll make it easy for you... The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) concludes that anthropogenic greenhouse gases are responsible for most of the observed temperature increase since the middle of the twentieth century, and that natural phenomena such as solar variation and volcanoes probably had a small warming effect from pre-industrial times to 1950 and a small cooling effect afterward. These basic conclusions have been endorsed by more than 40 scientific societies and academies of science, including all of the national academies of science of the major industrialized countries. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_warming .... there. That's what the experts think after lifetimes of studying the situation. It's happening and it's our fault. Look it up if you want. Now we can all go back to trawling for porn and posting about Cherie's sexual activities. It's not that simple, Steve. The IPCC has been wrong many times and has often made wildly inaccurate projections. Scientists can barely predict the weather a week in advance (despite having millennia of data and experience)... How then are climatologists predicting the weather 10, 50, 100 years into the future? You can't just extrapolate a line and say "That's what'll happen." And you can't ignore the fact that the earth experiences huge climate changes on a periodic basis - and was doing so before man started using fossil fuels. It's entirely up to you to believe climatologists or not. But it's a very 'grey' science at best. I don't use psychoanalysts or astrologers or psychiatrists or mediums - but lots of people do and swear by them (and I chose those four knowing that only some are 'proper' scientists). You can't berate people who read different stuff and have a different opinion than you. The scientific community has often been wrong over the years. We had a forum on this a few months ago - lots of interesting links and data - I can't be bothered looking them all up again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stramash Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 I don't think Global Warming is a hoax....But I think it's part of a natural cycle. As with many subjects, there are 'extremists' on both sides. There are many who say global warming as caused by man is a hoax and will gladly trot out reams of figures, graphs etc to prove their points. But as with many lobbying groups, you scratch the surface a bit and you find the funding for many of these groups come from those with a vested interest; oil companies, car manufacturers etc etc. And similarly, there are the extreme tree huggers (hmmm that could make an interesting sport) who say we are plunging towards an irreversible disaster. Here's my tuppence worth, garnered from reading both sides of the argument, looking at what has happened in the past and trying to read between the lines. IMHO global warming is real. Global warming is also part of a natural cycle of the planet's life. BUT...what seems certain, is that we are accelerating the process beyond what would be expected from a natural cycle. Now this is where it gets grey; what I cannot say, with any certainty, is whether that acceleration will push the natural cycle beyond what the planet can cope with by itself. I feel there will be some climatic changes, and I also think that some level of natural disasters will ensue worldwide. But that has always been the case, so it is just a question of how much greater the disasters are as a result of man's intervention. But the 'green lobby' pay too much attention to the damage done to forests, when the danger to phytoplankton is a greater risk. There also seems too be a lot of emphasis on this being our downfall, when perhaps, rather than an inch or 3 rise in sea level, we should be bothered more about a population that is growing far too quickly to be sustained by either natural or technological progress. I'm with Dave on the not feeling guilty about taking a plane or having my heating on, but I remember my dad always saying it was the little things that count, so I do turn lights off when I leave a room, I do recycle, and I do tend to use the subway if I don't need the car (am lucky that there is a subway station 5 mins from my house) so I feel it all balances out. My carbon footprint is very low and I try to keep it that way. But given that fossil fuels are beginning to deplete and that I believe (ok here I wander into conspiracy theory territory) that there already is non polluting technologies developed but suppressed by the industrial complex until they are really needed and they can't squeeze any more money out of oil consumption, I don't think we need to man the lifeboats just yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce551 Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 According to Peter Ward (paleontologist), The Medea Hypothesis is a term coined by paleontologist Peter Ward for the anti-Gaian hypothesis that multicellular life, understood as a superorganism, is suicidal. Succeeding at suicide would return Earth to the microbial-dominated state that has been the norm for most of its history.. Past suicide attempts include: Methane poisoning, (3.5 billion years ago) the Oxygen Catastrophe, (2.7 billion years ago) Snowball Earth twice, 2.3 billion years ago and 790-630 million years ago At least 5 Hydrogen sulfide-induced mass extinctions, such as the Great Dying, 251.4 million years ago Dr. Ward says the earth has already had CO2 levels of 1000 ppm, under that condition there were no ice caps and sea level rose 250ft and the ocean was contaminated with Hydrogen sulfide. YouTube - Peter Ward: Earth's mass extinctions (TED) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Ward_(paleontologist) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
English_Bob Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 According to Peter Ward (paleontologist),The Medea Hypothesis is a term coined by paleontologist Peter Ward for the anti-Gaian hypothesis that multicellular life, understood as a superorganism, is suicidal. Succeeding at suicide would return Earth to the microbial-dominated state that has been the norm for most of its history.. I side with Dr Thingy in Jurassic Park... the one who looked like Jeff Goldblum... He said "Life will find a way." as part of his Chaos Theory explanation. I don't buy the suicide theory of Dr Peter Hey-Girls-Sleep-With-Me-Before-The-World-Ends Ward. I'm not religious in that I don't subscribe to any organised religion, but I do feel earth is so beautifully complex and amazing that I find myself wondering if it's all an accident. It feels like a design. Just one tiny mosquito that can sense UV, heat, sound, light and dark - in that miniscule body - amazing. And trees that extract hundreds of gallons of water from the earth without a single moving part. Not to mention tides, migration, reproduction, sunsets, imagination, dreams, emotions... and boobies. It's all so ******* amazing I want to believe in some Great Architect. And that's why I want people to curb the pollution, oil consumption and thoughtless deforestation... if this Great Architect can create something so amazing as life, the universe and everything, imagine what he's gonna do to someone who fucks it all up... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.