[ B R I B E S ]

[luckyphil247]

A friend of mine was recently caught distributing substances... morales aside this as a good friend of mine. The price tag for his release was substantial. 3.2 million BHT. Now, the questions is - should we be thankfull for the opportunity to "buy" a good friend out of the situation and raise the funds to pay the bribe or should we believe in traditional justice and leave him to his own devices???

Personally , if he was my good friend , I would help him out .

It would have to be a secured loan of course ( beggars can't be choosers ) otherwise he can rot in hell .

[PeeMarc]

That's the most anyone says. The problem is it's a pathetic response. The attitude (and the populace's general education level and standards) has to change. The laws have to be enforced EQUALLY and/or changed to reflect 21st century modernism. Otherwise the country remains backwards in many respects; I acknowledge many want it to remain as it is.

Great principle.

So, if you're living, long term, in Thailand, would you never pay any bride for anything? Ever?

[bigKus]

But we don?t have to accept or do what we know that?s wrong or because other people do (if we all do that then we are idiots). No need any high moral minded, basically just a common sense. Cop doesn?t go around give people a fine or knock on your car and ask for a bride for no reasons. You did something wrong then they come after you.

In 2006 , I went out with some Farang friends that were also in BKK at the time . I went back to their hotel room and we kept drinking , the 2 guys had crashed after drinking so much but the 2 girls were sober as they had an early morning flight .

I had the idea of sharing a taxi with the girls , I could get dropped off at my hotel on the way to the airport . On the way , there was a road block set up by the police . The officer came towards our taxi and asked me to get out .

He asked where we were heading , and I explained that the girls were going back to Australia and I was going to my hotel room . Then he asked for my passport , and so I explained that I dont usually carry it with me , but that he could follow me back to my hotel to get it .

He said that we couldn't do that , so I had to go back with him to the police station . I really didn't want to go , but he was insisting .

Then came ....." ok you pay some money and you can go " .

I didn't offer to pay any money because I really had no idea how much I was expected to pay . Also I was a little paranoid , thinking he might charge me with bribery ( my 2nd time in Thailand ) .

I politely refused , and told him that I'd go to the poliice station if he still insisted . He asked me if I had a valid visa , and I gave him a wai while I promised that my visa was valid .

He looked at me ..... " ok you can go "

" Khop khun khrap " I replied

All the alcohol I had that night went to waste as I sobered up quick smart . Damn !!!

*refraining myself to not laugh* :? .. because its not funny, yes you smart i agreed with what you have done, but i also understand what the cops did to you too.. they called crimes prevention.

[vbroker]

I don?t pay a damn bride even if it gonna return me a huge favour. I don?t need a favour from corruption. If anyone wants to pay a bride, that?s fine. That?s your choice.

One more time: IT'S NOT FINE. It's criminal. In most civilized, developed countries major jail time looms for the government official (politicians, police, adjudicates, military, etc. and the higher up the food chain, the more time incarcerated) who engages in this conduct. Your prior post you stated bribing is shameful. Now here you are stating it's fine for others who choose to participate and it goes to my larger point: BY AND LARGE, THIS IS AN ACCEPTABLE CONDUCT FORM AS FAR AS MOST THAIS ARE CONCERNED. And that, at the root, is the problem. And it's killing your country.

But please don?t complain about how much corruption we have in our country(I?m talking about Thailand) because you are the one who make it happens.

Sorry but this is really dumb. "You" meaning I, meaning "farang" make corruption "happen" in your country?? Is this what Thais think? Or do farang engage/participate in bribing and corruption because it's something everyone seems to do? From the police to the politicians to the local street merchant. Further, in some instances, if farang don't cooperate and pay said bribe they can expect problems. It's often cheaper to just pay off said harasser and get on with life.

No, I don't complain about your country's rampant corruption. It has nothing to do with me. I'm just an observer. It's your country's and its citizens' problem. Whether or not you and your countrymen choose to "grow up," acknowledge and do something about it determines how many more coups and the like happen there going forward.

That's the most anyone says. The problem is it's a pathetic response. The attitude (and the populace's general education level and standards) has to change. The laws have to be enforced EQUALLY and/or changed to reflect 21st century modernism. Otherwise the country remains backwards in many respects; I acknowledge many want it to remain as it is.

Great principle.

So, if you're living, long term, in Thailand, would you never pay any bride for anything? Ever?

The question is too sweeping and absolute to issue a simple yes or no answer.

I'm the type that likes to talk myself into and out of things. So if some Thai cop is trying to pilfer me because I look like an easy way to line his pockets, I am going to make every effort to defeat his tactics WITHOUT further exacerbating my situation.

On the other hand, if this is the way "business" is done there and my not engaging otherwise questionable conduct elsewhere puts me at a competitive disadvantage, then my abstinence may be detrimental to my business. It boils down to cost versus gain or risk versus reward/advantage.

Last; what in the hell is a "bride" outside its traditional definition? Is that an intended typo or am I missing something?

[bigKus]

but i also understand what the cops did to you too.. they called crimes prevention.

NO DEAR ITS CALLED CORRUPTION!!!

Lucky enough phil fronted it out.

The cops prevented crime .. who knows what would happened if the cops didnt stop taxi while all their passengers were drunk.. ? Grr.. or you trust taxi driver ? They prevented Phile from being robbed by taxi driver. come on!

[PeeMarc]

Last; what in the hell is a "bride" outside its traditional definition? Is that an intended typo or am I missing something?

Just a typing error buddy. No hidden meaning. :wink:

Bribes, tips, gift giving etc are happening all over Asia and the world. Whats interesting here is that most of us hate it, but at the same time continue to condone it by paying them when it suits us.

Maybe one day we will have a Mahatma Ghandi type of character who will help us all rise above all this petty graft.

I've found that the best way to avoid paying a bribe (when confonted) is to remain very calm and cool, move slowly, smile and even joke a little. I would say this has worked 8 out of 10 times so far.

[PeeMarc]

The cops prevented crime .. who knows what would happened if the cops didnt stop taxi while all their passengers were drunk.. ? Grr.. or you trust taxi driver ? They prevented Phile from being robbed by taxi driver. come on!

What a wonderfully odd way of looking at that situation.

Do you have everything you need in that lovely fantasy bubble you seem to live in? Oxygen perhaps?

[MisterMatlock]

but i also understand what the cops did to you too.. they called crimes prevention.

NO DEAR ITS CALLED CORRUPTION!!!

Lucky enough phil fronted it out.

The cops prevented crime .. who knows what would happened if the cops didnt stop taxi while all their passengers were drunk.. ? Grr.. or you trust taxi driver ? They prevented Phile from being robbed by taxi driver. come on!

Yes. I'm sure that's why the policeman stopped the taxi. Because the occupants were drunk and the taxi driver might take advantage of them... :wink:

[bigKus]

The cops prevented crime .. who knows what would happened if the cops didnt stop taxi while all their passengers were drunk.. ? Grr.. or you trust taxi driver ? They prevented Phile from being robbed by taxi driver. come on!

What a wonderfully odd way of looking at that situation.

Do you have everything you need in that lovely fantasy bubble you seem to live in? Oxygen perhaps?

8) .. Life is beautiful, PeeMarc.

I live in this country long enough, you should do the same.. you might probably love Thailand even more.. :wink:

[PeeMarc]

The cops prevented crime .. who knows what would happened if the cops didnt stop taxi while all their passengers were drunk.. ? Grr.. or you trust taxi driver ? They prevented Phile from being robbed by taxi driver. come on!

What a wonderfully odd way of looking at that situation.

Do you have everything you need in that lovely fantasy bubble you seem to live in? Oxygen perhaps?

8) .. Life is beautiful, PeeMarc.

I live in this country long enough, you should do the same.. you might probably love Thailand even more.. :wink:

Yes dear, life is very beautiful. And yes, I do love Thailand too.

But as for dreaming up lovely little fantasies to avoid facing or dealing with a harsh reality or fact, thats not Thai. That's universally known as being an 'air-head'. If you were a farang, you would be 'blonde' I would imagine.

[bigKus]

The cops prevented crime .. who knows what would happened if the cops didnt stop taxi while all their passengers were drunk.. ? Grr.. or you trust taxi driver ? They prevented Phile from being robbed by taxi driver. come on!

What a wonderfully odd way of looking at that situation.

Do you have everything you need in that lovely fantasy bubble you seem to live in? Oxygen perhaps?

8) .. Life is beautiful, PeeMarc.

I live in this country long enough, you should do the same.. you might probably love Thailand even more.. :wink:

Yes dear, life is very beautiful. And yes, I do love Thailand too.

But as for dreaming up lovely little fantasies to avoid facing or dealing with a harsh reality or fact, thats not Thai. That's universally known as being an 'air-head'. If you were a farang, you would be 'blonde' I would imagine.

Okay.. i will handle things here... thing by thing..

glad to be 'blonde', never wear my hair blonde color even once but i know 'blonde' has some (good) reputation. 8)

But i have to tell you gentlemen here that im not farang, i have my own perspective about err.. the cops job. And i never bribed anyone, honestly. I have often been stopped my car and asked for my driving license, asked me about where have i been ( on the way home late night ) i show them my driving license, i told them where i ve been that all what i done.. i dont see the reason that why i have to pay the fines or the bribes you called.

Im not an ignorant (air-head /blonde by PeeMarc ) Im just an understandable ordinary thai people :wink:

[bigKus]

bigkus they say silence is a virtue but in your case I would say its essential.

You are so kind to me uk_soldier

If some certain TF members were around, they would ask me shut the f**k up !

It's just my view point, you dont have to believe and do what i said, you know that ?? :roll:

[PeeMarc]

bigkus they say silence is a virtue but in your case I would say its essential.

I do believe this is a very nice way to say you should shut the f*ck up Bigkus...

(someone paid me to point that out)

[CiaranM]

but i also understand what the cops did to you too.. they called crimes prevention.

NO DEAR ITS CALLED CORRUPTION!!!

Lucky enough phil fronted it out.

The cops prevented crime .. who knows what would happened if the cops didnt stop taxi while all their passengers were drunk.. ? Grr.. or you trust taxi driver ? They prevented Phile from being robbed by taxi driver. come on!

yeah so instead of being robbed by the taxi driver the cops tried to rob him. crime prevention at it's best !! :roll: :roll:

a prime example of why corruption here will be so difficult to stamp out !!

however, those of us from farang-land need to remember that there's a lot of bribery and corruption in our own countries. although it's probably not as "in ur face" and the consequences if caught are considerably higher !!

[bigKus]

bigkus they say silence is a virtue but in your case I would say its essential.

I do believe this is a very nice way to say you should shut the f*ck up Bigkus...

(someone paid me to point that out)

PeeMarch, you disappointed me. :? were you cheap ? How much they paid you ?

But pass my words to them, if i couldnt speak here, no one can !

[PeeMarc]

But pass my words to them, if i couldnt speak here, no one can !

Sorry to be blunt (although not really) but not everyone on here would have come up with the cops just preventing crime thing lol.

At least you get irony :roll:

Are you also getting a kick-back to be so nice

[bigKus]

But pass my words to them, if i couldnt speak here, no one can !

Sorry to be blunt (although not really) but not everyone on here would have come up with the cops just preventing crime thing lol.

At least you get irony :roll:

It's just my humble point of view , i didnt see a sign of 'no idoit post allowed' though.

Be reminded, im thai, this is thailand, and if my brian been called 'air' i dont know about the rest..

[PeeMarc]

But pass my words to them, if i couldnt speak here, no one can !

Sorry to be blunt (although not really) but not everyone on here would have come up with the cops just preventing crime thing lol.

At least you get irony :roll:

It's just my humble point of view , i didnt see a sign of 'no idoit post allowed' though.

Be reminded, im thai, this is thailand, and if my brian been called 'air' i dont know about the rest..

Oh yeah... lets drag out the "I'm Thai, this is Thailand and this is the way we do in Thailand..." stuff. Brilliant.

I'm sorry, but being Thai or living here doesnt give you any reason or excuse for being an air-head. You can be any nationality to achieve that status.

And no, you probably dont know much about the rest either.

Of course, idiots are always quite welcome to post here. You do know that at least.

[bigKus]

But pass my words to them, if i couldnt speak here, no one can !

Sorry to be blunt (although not really) but not everyone on here would have come up with the cops just preventing crime thing lol.

At least you get irony :roll:

It's just my humble point of view , i didnt see a sign of 'no idoit post allowed' though.

Be reminded, im thai, this is thailand, and if my brian been called 'air' i dont know about the rest..

Oh yeah... lets drag out the "I'm Thai, this is Thailand and this is the way we do in Thailand..." stuff. Brilliant.

I'm sorry, but being Thai or living here doesnt give you any reason or excuse for being an air-head. You can be any nationality to achieve that status.

And no, you probably dont know much about the rest either.

Of course, idiots are always quite welcome to post here. You do know that at least.

PeeMarc ja.. i said im thai, this is thailand = i could have diffirent points from yours.. FARRRRANGGGGS darnnnn.. what da hell going on here.. i didnt say what in black bolded .. how could you thought on behalf of me.. i over qualified you.. i thought you were smarter.. darnnnnnnnnnnnn

And its true that i was get irony, about crime prevent but that's true in what they claims it to you, but for you every one farangs who paid the bribes/fines you have your right to protect yourselve also, you have your right to refuse not pay them unless you did something proved it your re wrong

May i get back to work now ?? :roll: :x

[Channaa15]

The problem with accepting bribery in small forms is that it will always escalate to larger forms.

There have been many cases of murder/manslaughter where the rich have escaped jail time because of pay offs.

I have actually seen a payment made from a group of thugs to the police and know for a fact people from their 'group' are responsible for the murder of fellow workers of mine.

Corruption is so bad here, locals don't even call it corruption anymore: its part of the business environment. Just another expense in life.

I firmly believe Thailand would be light years ahead of were it is now if there was no corruption (or little corruption).

Also as an ex-cop it makes me so angry to see cops involved in this. They are supposed to be there to help the community, not take from it. I feel so sorry for Thai people having to live in a society that gives you nowhere to go to if you really need help. But I honestly do not see it changing for a long long time, if ever. Its so ingrained now in life. Its one of the saddest things here.

[PeeMarc]

But pass my words to them, if i couldnt speak here, no one can !

Sorry to be blunt (although not really) but not everyone on here would have come up with the cops just preventing crime thing lol.

At least you get irony :roll:

It's just my humble point of view , i didnt see a sign of 'no idoit post allowed' though.

Be reminded, im thai, this is thailand, and if my brian been called 'air' i dont know about the rest..

Oh yeah... lets drag out the "I'm Thai, this is Thailand and this is the way we do in Thailand..." stuff. Brilliant.

I'm sorry, but being Thai or living here doesnt give you any reason or excuse for being an air-head. You can be any nationality to achieve that status.

And no, you probably dont know much about the rest either.

Of course, idiots are always quite welcome to post here. You do know that at least.

PeeMarc ja.. i said im thai, this is thailand = i could have diffirent points from yours.. FARRRRANGGGGS darnnnn.. what da hell going on here.. i didnt say what in black bolded .. how could you thought on behalf of me.. i over qualified you.. i thought you were smarter.. darnnnnnnnnnnnn

And its true that i was get irony, about crime prevent but that's true in what they claims it to you, but for you every one farangs who paid the bribes/fines you have your right to protect yourselve also, you have your right to refuse not pay them unless you did something proved it your re wrong

May i get back to work now ?? :roll: :x

So... those 5 or 6 friendly policemen who stand either side of the main road (where I used to live) in Town in Town are just stopping cars to prevent crime? Oh... I see. Thanks for explaining that.

They seem to be there every friday afternoon and just before any public holidays because i suppose that when the most crime takes place.

And all those happy Thai people, being stopped for no reason really, are just handing over their hard-earned cash to society?

Got it. Lovely.

And all the Thai people in the shops and stalls around there, where I ate everyday, would grumble and complain amongst themselves about those cops (I do understand most of what they say).

Why would they complain and snarl so much? Because those cops were 'preventing' some crime?

Isn't life beautiful?

[CiaranM]

Of course, idiots are always quite welcome to post here. You do know that at least.

if idiots didn't post here TF wouldn't be half as much fun !!!

[PeeMarc]

Of course, idiots are always quite welcome to post here. You do know that at least.

if idiots didn't post here TF wouldn't be half as much fun !!!

Very true.

(but did someone pay you to say that?)

[CiaranM]

So... those 5 or 6 friendly policemen who stand either side of the main road (where I used to live) in Town in Town are just stopping cars to prevent crime? Oh... I see. Thanks for explaining that.

They seem to be there every friday afternoon and just before any public holidays because i suppose that when the most crime takes place.

And all those happy Thai people, being stopped for no reason really, are just handing over their hard-earned cash to society?

Got it. Lovely.

And all the Thai people in the shops and stalls around there, where I ate everyday, would grumble and complain amongst themselves about those cops (I do understand most of what they say).

Why would they complain and snarl so much? Because those cops were 'preventing' some crime?

Isn't life beautiful?

i guess the rose tint in ur glasses wore off a long time ago Marc . . . .

maybe Bigkus can lend U hers ! ! ! ! :roll: :arrow: :twisted:

[PeeMarc]

So... those 5 or 6 friendly policemen who stand either side of the main road (where I used to live) in Town in Town are just stopping cars to prevent crime? Oh... I see. Thanks for explaining that.

They seem to be there every friday afternoon and just before any public holidays because i suppose that when the most crime takes place.

And all those happy Thai people, being stopped for no reason really, are just handing over their hard-earned cash to society?

Got it. Lovely.

And all the Thai people in the shops and stalls around there, where I ate everyday, would grumble and complain amongst themselves about those cops (I do understand most of what they say).

Why would they complain and snarl so much? Because those cops were 'preventing' some crime?

Isn't life beautiful?

i guess the rose tint in ur glasses wore off a long time ago Marc . . . .

maybe Bigkus can lend U hers ! ! ! ! :roll: :arrow: :twisted:

Mate, after living in Malaysia for 3 years and Vietnam for 2, Thailand seems to me to be amateurs when it comes to petty bribes and corruption.

I've found, overall, that tourists dont get into too much trouble here. The real issue is that most of the real corruption is Thai against fellow Thai and that Thai people like bigkus have this 'mai pen rai' attitude or just completely ignore it and pretend it either doesn't really exist or will go away.

If you look at most of the real hard issues happening in Thailand - corruption, prostitution and drugs - a lot of everyday Thai people dont know all the facts, pretend they dont exist (to the extent they do) or in general just sweep in under the silk carpet.

Arai kor dai :roll: