Addictions & ThailandFriends

[zeusbheld]

the careful observer will note that, relative to the cost of living, alcohol is much more expensive in thailand than in the west.

just sayin.

Correct. You forgot to define the context, however. I'll do it for you.

If your rent is 4000 Baht (find the feline-friendly joint yet?) and you're spending 200 Baht per day on street food you could manage to get your living cost down to around 10,000 Baht per month. That's U.S. $300. That's impossible to do in any major (or even minor) U.S. city. If all else is equal, that is you have a western income/pension, that leaves one helluva lot of left over discretionary booze funds, doesn't it? You could bring in as little as U.S. $1,000 or 35,000 Baht per month and accomplish this feat. You'd have roughly 25,000 Baht left over to buy 250 beers at 100 Baht per beer. That's over 8 per day; every day of the month. Enough to drink yourself into an early grave; even at western prices.

that is misleading. most jobs here pay diddly ****. most english teachers earn between 20,000 and 50,000 baht (the more industrious earn more; but i suspect the heavy drinkers would not cut into their drinking time for mere extra work).

percentage-wise, very few of the farrangs here (and most likely even fewer of the pattaya balcony jumpers) earn anything like their western salary. (i'm doing quite well by farrang-in-thailand standards of income---and i'm making about 1/6 my best salary in new york). most of the people making western salaries work for western companies, such as investment banks, consulting firms, manufacturing concerns, etc. key word there: WORK. these aren't the people drinking themselves to death.

i suspect the people drinking themselves to death has more to do with depression than demon rum. many farrangs seem to assume thailand is a silver bullet, a paradise that will solve all their problems, where they'll live like kings. then they find their pension doesn't go as far as they thought, and that the girls falling all over them are really just friendly hookers, they haven't suddenly transformed into studs. take a look around at some of the guys in some of the bars here, they were desperate and hopeless when they got here, they will sometimes go out that way (via a pattaya balcony). if you were a mess before you got here, you'll still be a mess.

as to our own two dead, no disrespect to the members in question, but there were attempts at intervention from what i understand. one was somewhat in denial about health issues, and one's excesses were consistent with his behavior before arriving in thailand.

as for my own attempted intervention on behalf of a suicidal friend... it seems to have worked... for now anyway. she's back in beijing, staying with friends, has twice weekly appointments with a doctor, and is pumped full of prozac until my 'team of researchers' can unearth more advanced treatments. really, though... it's ultimately up to her. severe depression isn't just a question of mentaiity, it is a brain chemistry issue. there's a war going on in her head. she's been losing lately but hopefully has turned the corner. time will tell.

PS yep i found a place in ratchada, very close to the MRT, for 4,500 (well let's be honest *i* didnt find diddly squat; a hired gun found it for me). this does wonders for my crack budget....

[Guest Tattoodude]

If you have nothing good to say about Thailand why come here? And more's the point why inflict your twisted bullshit on everyone else?

Off on a tangent, are we?

Not really, all you do is complain you cheap bastard, come to my shop use the internet without buying anything and then produce your 3000 (WOW!) bahts worth of receipts and judge the Western reaction to your piss take.

And now Thailand is responsible due to it's non caring society?

Mate, if anyones on a tangent here it ain't me.

Ever been around death?

Nahhhhhhh.....you're the only one, Confucius.

Simple enough question General, to complicated for you? Let me break it down into language a four year old will understand. Your post is tasteless and shows little or no respect either for the dead or the living, geddit?

Kind of gave me the impression that you don't know what the **** your talking about, which makes you an idiot, if you do know what your talking about then you have shown very little class or compassion which again makes you an idiot.

Conclusion... Idiot.

You try and portray class and have none.

Ouch........now I'm really insulted. *Yawn.*

Seems to have touched a nerve so my work here is done.

Have you ever considered giving up your mission and getting a LIFE?

Chances are you and I will agree on pretty much.....nothing. As regards most subjects. Given the earlier "logic" employed to justify combining prostitution and long term relationships, no surprise there. Whatever......and thanks for the wonderful comments.

Twisting are we? What ******* comments. You mean the alternative point of view to the popular one? I'm not a sheep. Nothing is clear cut and that is what I put forward. However thats not what you meant is it?

So I dented your ever soooooo fragile ego and the best you can come up with is "he dates hookers".

Hey I'm crushed.

So another farang with a receding hairline superior up his own arse attitude comes to Thailand and only dates good girls... yeah right. Thats right baldy I mean you!

Chances are you and I will agree on pretty much.....nothing.

Never say never. One day you might wake up and realize that you are a complete prick. When that day comes I will be with you all the way.

[Guest Tattoodude]

So the questions remain. If you see your good friend on a downward spiral, do you step in and say something right away? Do you wait until he or she broaches the subject before you do? Do you say nothing and wait to offer support at such time when it's obvious you're needed? Or is "mum" the word?

Ahhhh so the question has changed?

Are your eyes brown? I just wondered given your so full of ****.

[frankenburner2]

vbroker...I'm confused...do you like Thailand, or not? You're here, you attend parties, participate in Thailandfriends, have a job(?), enjoy looking at (leering at) beautiful women...and yet you persist??...again...I am confused.

I'll save the obvious "if you don't like it here, why not just piss off" comment once I have your answer....

I left Korea 3 years ago because, in spite of a good job, a nice place to live, lots of extra cash, and plenty of friends, I was becoming the 'waegook' that continuously complained about Korea. I just couldn't accept the bizarro culture that went with all of the above. I left before people had the chance to tell me ""if you don't like it here, why not just piss off"

[Guest Tattoodude]

I have heard rumors there is/was something like one farang suicide per day (week?) in Pattaya.

You can't leave the house for fat farang jumpers, not without a hard hat anyway.

I can't help but think these people arrive at this point following a long, drug and alcohol fueled trip.

I drove here, it was pretty uneventful. If you have a number for the drug/alcohol disco bus can you pm it?

I think this website has and will continue to bring more and more people together and thus put others into nearer proximity with potential addicts.

WOW!

Am I in danger of being corrupted by Thailand Friends?

Makes me wonder what you are doing on the site given the "dangers". Perhaps I am wrong about you?

Have you got drug or alcohol issues and blame the site?

Hey, if you have give me a call I have been through a lot in life and learned a lot through my mistakes, I can share those experiences with you they may help.

In the meantime:

"YOUR ONLY AS STRONG AS WHAT YOU CANNOT RESIST"

Thats my help and advice for everyone with addictions, digest it. If after you have taken it in you are happy to be as weak as that next beer, next line or like me that next Marlboro then you are pretty much past help

Ciggies, still cant kick them, know their killing me but keep failing to stop.

By your own logic should you now not be helping me general? I mean if anything happens to me how would you feel now that you know I have a problem?

Surely given the soap box you should be the first to my rescue.

*Sit's waiting for pm with baited breath.... and a packet of Marlboro.*

[vbroker]

as for my own attempted intervention on behalf of a suicidal friend... it seems to have worked... for now anyway. she's back in beijing, staying with friends, has twice weekly appointments with a doctor, and is pumped full of prozac until my 'team of researchers' can unearth more advanced treatments. really, though... it's ultimately up to her. severe depression isn't just a question of mentaiity, it is a brain chemistry issue. there's a war going on in her head. she's been losing lately but hopefully has turned the corner. time will tell.

Agree it's up to her the individual in the end. Good for you on intervening and good luck to your friend.

vbroker...I'm confused...do you like Thailand, or not? You're here, you attend parties, participate in Thailandfriends, have a job(?), enjoy looking at (leering at) beautiful women...and yet you persist??...again...I am confused.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes and absolutely. Persist? Granted, if I'm understanding you, in other posts on other subjects, I've intended to push buttons. Here, I did not. Was it such a terrible thing to bring this subject up at all? Look, I'm not out to get anyone's goose or to disrespect anyone; alive or dead. Or to tell anyone how to live their life. On the other hand, I thought I asked legit questions. But, as an alteration on the old saying goes, "you can't please everyone all of the time" and this is the TF forum to boot. If telling me to go f*ck myself is what gets one through the afternoon, then have at it. I can say everyone I have met there has been pleasant, interesting to talk with, a pleasure to know and another reason among many to come back. As a sometimes visitor, my Thailand/BKK minutia knowledge base will be more limited than those living there and, as such, my perspective may differ from a local's. You authored "the dumbest forum topic ever" for obvious reasons. I was just trying to keep things interesting or maybe you need to include this topic in your thread subject.

Ink, I'll answer the one question asked I feel like answering: a nicotine patch or gum in lieu of the cigs, a little will power and temptation avoidance by staying away from other smokers.

[Guest Tattoodude]

Ink, I'll answer the one question asked I feel like answering: a nicotine patch or gum in lieu of the cigs, a little will power and temptation avoidance by staying away from other smokers.

OK thats good advice. But what you have to remember is that I have been smoking twenty years, thats some addiction to break, I stopped recently for three months and then relapsed, so is that one sentence enough?

I feel I owe you an explanation as to my reaction to this thread:

"Helping" a friend who is on a self destructive course is not just a matter of a quick answer, it's a full time job, I've been there. My friend in question had a real problem with the powder. Like many users of the white stuff he thought he was in control and it "made him a better person".

I watched him lose his business, his family, his kids you name it. All the time I was there on his case trying to make him see sense and I always got the same response:

"It's not the gear"

One day he actually realized he had a problem, as usual this was way too late. He had by this time lost just about everything and also had some reasonably heavy people knocking on his door because he owed them.

We got him in a program, his wife took him back into the house she was now renting, another mate gave him a job and I had to go settle a bill on his behalf with wanna be plastic gangsters who I would under usual circumstances not cross the road to piss on if they were on fire.

Happy ending?

No. Within four months despite the support of everyone he was back on the gear. I lost circa 3000 sterling, my other mate lost a similar amount (he was paying us back monthly), his wife took a beating because she was the first to know and was going to inform the rest of us and guess who was getting the phone calls from the wangsters when they again let him run up a bill?

This was a childhood friend who came from a good background and out of all us was the "sensible one" as a kid.

"YOU CANT HELP SOME PEOPLE!"

So I am going to answer your original question. Would I help a friend who had chosen a path of self destruction again?

No.

I would offer the sensible advice as you have with regard to my smoking, but would I be the one there every day making sure that advice was followed? Hell no never again.

The whole Thailand connection does not stack up, part of the reason I moved here was to get away from this cancer. Have you actually any idea how bad the problem is in the UK now?

With regards to TF' responsibility in "bringing addicts together" trust me as someone has said before "Misery loves company" they would find each other without any assistance from this web site.

[CiaranM]

The whole Thailand connection does not stack up, part of the reason I moved here was to get away from this cancer. Have you actually any idea how bad the problem is in the UK now?

With regards to TF' responsibility in "bringing addicts together" trust me as someone has said before "Misery loves company" they would find each other without any assistance from this web site.

what he said .... also u can't help ppl who aren't prepared to help themselves !!!

[zeusbheld]

The whole Thailand connection does not stack up, part of the reason I moved here was to get away from this cancer. Have you actually any idea how bad the problem is in the UK now?

With regards to TF' responsibility in "bringing addicts together" trust me as someone has said before "Misery loves company" they would find each other without any assistance from this web site.

this is a good point that would be obvious to anyone who has seen addiction up close and personal.

for example: a schoolmate of mine, a recovered junkie, stayed at my apartment in bkk last year. he was talking about addictions and some of his experiences. he concluded with, if he wanted to get back on the junk, he could walk outside (we were at MBK) and score within half an hour. i know him well enough to trust him on this. he'd been in bangkok less than 48 hours when he said this.

[vbroker]

OK thats good advice. But what you have to remember is that I have been smoking twenty years, thats some addiction to break, I stopped recently for three months and then relapsed, so is that one sentence enough?

Nope. Dekka journal He's got 27 years on you and I hope he didn't relapse. You're going to let a mere cig addiction get the better of you, tough guy?

I feel I owe you an explanation as to my reaction to this thread:

First, you owe me nothing, but I appreciate the sentiment. It's better than "you're full of ****" and "you're a prick" true or not hehehe. Second, this (your sad experience) is what I was after. What will you do or have done when a FRIEND has an addiction problem and he/she is destroying him/herself and everyone around them? Next time, maybe you'll consider saving the verbal rampage and get to the point. Or maybe not; as stated earlier, whatever floats your boat.

"YOU CANT HELP SOME PEOPLE!"

No ****, Sherlock. Sorry, I couldn't resist...........

So I am going to answer your original question. Would I help a friend who had chosen a path of self destruction again?

No.

I would offer the sensible advice as you have with regard to my smoking, but would I be the one there every day making sure that advice was followed? Hell no never again.

Offering "sensible advice" to a close friend may not be enough. Laying out thousands of pounds sterling to cover unpaid smack transactions may be going too far. The point is you, of all people, are in a unique position to possibly know how much support to offer and how much "tough love" to administer given your prior experience.

The whole Thailand connection does not stack up, part of the reason I moved here was to get away from this cancer. Have you actually any idea how bad the problem is in the UK now?

Point missed. The problem is terrible everywhere in the west. But again, I am going on what I see and therefore I perceive. Granted, I tend to stay and hang in or near the tourist areas, where the issue appears, to me at least, more concentrated.

With regards to TF' responsibility in "bringing addicts together" trust me as someone has said before "Misery loves company" they would find each other without any assistance from this web site.

Point missed....again. The website and the various events are promoting close relationships and intimate friendships on a scale that before this website existed would have been impossible. I repeat: THE WEBSITE AND THE VARIOUS EVENTS ARE PROMOTING CLOSE RELATIONSHIPS AND INTIMATE FRIENDSHIPS ON A SCALE THAT BEFORE THIS WEBSITE EXISTED WOULD HAVE BEEN IMPOSSIBLE. Where did this "bringing addicts together" come from? I didn't say it. I placed zero blame on TF or Thailand. It is simple numbers. More people connecting means more relationships and friendships. Sooner or later some of those people are going to turn up with problems and the others that know them might want to help out. It's just the human condition. In that event, what do you do? Is all I asked.

[CiaranM]

Point missed....again. The website and the various events are promoting close relationships and intimate friendships on a scale that before this website existed would have been impossible. I repeat: THE WEBSITE AND THE VARIOUS EVENTS ARE PROMOTING CLOSE RELATIONSHIPS AND INTIMATE FRIENDSHIPS ON A SCALE THAT BEFORE THIS WEBSITE EXISTED WOULD HAVE BEEN IMPOSSIBLE. Where did this "bringing addicts together" come from? I didn't say it. I placed zero blame on TF or Thailand. It is simple numbers. More people connecting means more relationships and friendships. Sooner or later some of those people are going to turn up with problems and the others that know them might want to help out. It's just the human condition. In that event, what do you do? Is all I asked.

if u believe that to be true u must have a pretty sad life !!!!!

[CiaranM]

The whole Thailand connection does not stack up, part of the reason I moved here was to get away from this cancer. Have you actually any idea how bad the problem is in the UK now?

Point missed. The problem is terrible everywhere in the west. But again, I am going on what I see and therefore I perceive. Granted, I tend to stay and hang in or near the tourist areas, where the issue appears, to me at least, more concentrated.

geeeezzzzz .... u hang around tourist areas in bkk and u see lots of ppl getting drunk .... come on ..... try most tourist areas anywhere in the developed world and what do u think u r gonnA see !!!!

try ibiza in spain and it'll make BKK look like a playschool !!!

[Guest Tattoodude]

I think this website has and will continue to bring more and more people together and thus put others into nearer proximity with potential addicts.?

no?

[Guest Tattoodude]

OK thats good advice. But what you have to remember is that I have been smoking twenty years, thats some addiction to break, I stopped recently for three months and then relapsed, so is that one sentence enough?

Nope. Dekka journal He's got 27 years on you and I hope he didn't relapse. You're going to let a mere cig addiction get the better of you, tough guy?

mate your boring me. Is that the best you can do? wow helpful.

I feel I owe you an explanation as to my reaction to this thread:

First, you owe me nothing, but I appreciate the sentiment. It's better than "you're full of sh*t" and "you're a prick" true or not hehehe. Second, this (your sad experience) is what I was after. What will you do or have done when a FRIEND has an addiction problem and he/she is destroying him/herself and everyone around them? Next time, maybe you'll consider saving the verbal rampage and get to the point. Or maybe not; as stated earlier, whatever floats your boat.

"YOU CANT HELP SOME PEOPLE!"

No sh*t, Sherlock. Sorry, I couldn't resist...........

thats how it starts, a low resistance level.

So I am going to answer your original question. Would I help a friend who had chosen a path of self destruction again?

No.

I would offer the sensible advice as you have with regard to my smoking, but would I be the one there every day making sure that advice was followed? Hell no never again.

Offering "sensible advice" to a close friend may not be enough. Laying out thousands of pounds sterling to cover unpaid smack transactions may be going too far. The point is you, of all people, are in a unique position to possibly know how much support to offer and how much "tough love" to administer given your prior experience.

who the **** said anything about smack? If your going to crow about a subject at least do some research so you sound like you know what you are talking about.

So I am in a unique position? The position being knowing that helping someone that far gone can actually have a detrimental effect on my life, my business and my responsibilties and family.

Big ******* price to pay to help someone dontcha think?

The whole Thailand connection does not stack up, part of the reason I moved here was to get away from this cancer. Have you actually any idea how bad the problem is in the UK now?

Point missed. The problem is terrible everywhere in the west. But again, I am going on what I see and therefore I perceive. Granted, I tend to stay and hang in or near the tourist areas, where the issue appears, to me at least, more concentrated.

nah, your not just missing the point you way out there.

With regards to TF' responsibility in "bringing addicts together" trust me as someone has said before "Misery loves company" they would find each other without any assistance from this web site.

Point missed....again. The website and the various events are promoting close relationships and intimate friendships on a scale that before this website existed would have been impossible. I repeat: THE WEBSITE AND THE VARIOUS EVENTS ARE PROMOTING CLOSE RELATIONSHIPS AND INTIMATE FRIENDSHIPS ON A SCALE THAT BEFORE THIS WEBSITE EXISTED WOULD HAVE BEEN IMPOSSIBLE. Where did this "bringing addicts together" come from? I didn't say it. I placed zero blame on TF or Thailand. It is simple numbers. More people connecting means more relationships and friendships. Sooner or later some of those people are going to turn up with problems and the others that know them might want to help out. It's just the human condition. In that event, what do you do? Is all I asked.

I answered eventually, but what a waste of time that was. Your ignorance in this subject is actually part of the problem. You my friend have friends who more than likely have problems already, becos you would not have a clue, so what ******* help are you?

You sit in judgement. Your original post actually points a finger at this site and the people who knew the two people the site has lost, from there it's all been about you and justifying you original statement, your not wrong how can you be?

You have never lived through it thats evident.

The oral exam at the school of life is real easy, the Practical is a bit more difficult, go away help someone then come back and tell the rest of us how to do it. You can usually find an addict of some sort anywhere in the world

"your not going to let a cigarette beat you are you tough guy?" displays a stupidity that I have only ever seen displayed once before in my life. At officer level in the army.

Clever people, no ******* common sense.