Steroids and Baseball

[Loburt]

What should Major League Baseball do about players who are using, and who have used, steroids?

When a player, such as Barry Bonds, admits to having used steroids (he claims he didn't know what he was using), should his single-season home run record be allowed to stand?

Should it be erased from the record books?

Have an asterisk placed next to it?

Do players using drugs to build their bodies and improve their performance piss you off, or do all the home runs and power pitchers actually make you enjoy the game more? Is it ruining the game, or putting more fannies in the seats?

P.S. If you don't like baseball and want to say so, go start your own thread. Stay out of this one.

[Loburt]

Were they on steroids too?

[cs3602001]

I beleive the use of steroids greatly increases the excitement of a game, giving hitters that additional power that can really add a bang to the game....

They should be made legal in sports, then we woudl see some real pushing of human the human boundaries.

[bored]

i admit i have used steroids in my life but not for baseball purposes. i'd say more fore bald purposes. i was young and silly and... i could run very fast. i also knew what it was. i was buying and my girlfriend was giving me the shots.

waiting for your asterisk.

PS. can anybody tell who was using steroids, asterix or obelix?

PPS. i do like baseball

[zeusbheld]

short answer: records in sports should be based on what was legal/illegal at the time.

i used steriods for a while, too... for their testicle-shrinking effect, my ornaments were the size of watermelons, buying pants was awkward...

[cs3602001]

they also increase aggressiveness in some cases, which will lead to more violence and fighting in sport, which is always a good thing from a spectators point of view.

Andy,

Agreed, that is a very valid point, imagine open steroid use in rugby, it would be excellent and more in boxing too.

[TLOS4me]

When I was growing up, everyone in my neighborhood loved playing baseball, we all followed it and rooted for the local team, the Tigers. Of course the Yanks or the Red Sox always seemed to make it to the WS. Even so I enjoyed the excitment of watching it on TV.

Anyways, as I have moved on in my life, I have figured it out I think. Pro sports *really* do not care about the fans anymore, they only care about themselves! Basically it is the owners vs. the players and they are both vs. the fans, who really want to have a good time, but foolishly squander their hard earned money to enrich the players and owners, their choice of course.

So, if you want to go to see a game, remember that it is your $$$ are used to pay the salaries of the players who now seem to have to use chemical advantages to please you. Why not just play Nintendo or Xbox instead? Probably cheaper in the long run!

I say put double ** next to their records, but frankly I don't give a rat's ass anymore... But! Still have my Hank Arron baseball cards! (any offers? Seriously! They'll fit into my pocket and will slip past customs no problem my next trip there...)

[Loburt]

People who advocate the use illegal drugs and more violence in sports are sick.

[cs3602001]

Steroids shouldn't be used in sports, they only ruin the user's life, just like any other drug. Why do you think no sports allow them? It's not because of their 'great benefits'

AY,

You are somewhat naive if you believe that sports governing bodies ban the use of steroids due to the fact they "ruin the user's life".

I am not sure how well versed you are in the field of steroids and other substances that enhance individuals performance, but believe me there a lot of substances that, when used in the correct quantities certainly do not ruin the users life, but will have a substantially positive impact on their performance.

The governing bodies are concerned about keeping the sport on an even playing field, therefore if one person has an unfair advantage due to steroids, then they want to know about it and get the person disqualified, they really do not look at policy and think "Oh we should ban steroids as they ruin users lives".....come on mate, wake up.

[Loburt]

The New York Times

VACAVILLE, Calif. - Brenda Marrero came upon her son Efrain surfing the Internet one day last October. When Efrain hid what was on the screen, she asked what he had been looking at. He turned and said he wanted to tell her something: He was using steroids.

She called her husband, Frank, and they told Efrain he needed to stop, because steroids are dangerous.

"But Barry Bonds does it," his parents remember Efrain saying.

"That doesn't make it right," his father responded.

To please his parents, Efrain retrieved a dozen pink pills, a vial of liquid and two syringes. His mother flushed the pills and kept the vial. Efrain, who played football, promised to stop using steroids. It was a promise that no one doubts he kept.

Three and a half weeks later, Mrs. Marrero found Efrain in a bedroom at home, a bullet in his head, a .22-caliber pistol in his hand. He left no explanation for his suicide. He had no history of depression or mental illness. He was 19.

"We didn't see it coming," Mrs. Marrero said, crying. "We were absolutely devastated."

Not until weeks later did the Marreros learn that their son had been surrounded by steroids; his sister's boyfriend, co-workers at the mall and other weight lifters at his gym used steroids. And when Efrain went off to the College of the Siskiyous, he joined a football team in which a number of players were using steroids, three former teammates said.

And not until they learned what steroid withdrawal can do to a teenager's hormones did the Marreros find a plausible explanation for Efrain's suicide: the family, their doctor and their friends think that Efrain fell into an abyss from having suddenly stopped using steroids.

Two previous suicides had been attributed by parents to steroid use by young athletes: Rob Garibaldi, 24, of Petaluma, Calif., in 2002, and Taylor Hooton, 17, of Plano, Tex., in 2003. The athletes, both baseball players, died shortly after they stopped using steroids.

At a time of increasing concern about the use of steroids by young athletes and the long-term health risks associated with the drugs, the three suicides, while extreme, have underscored for many medical experts the short-term risks linked to withdrawal from steroids.

Donald Hooton Sr., Taylor's father, is scheduled to be among the witnesses discussing steroid use by teenagers at a hearing today of Congressional health and consumer protection subcommittees. Mr. Hooton and Mr. Garibaldi's parents have also been invited to testify on baseball's steroids policy before the House Committee on Government Reform on March 17, and the Marreros said they planned to attend.

Many medical experts suspect that other teenage suicides have been connected to the cessation of steroid use, because adolescents are especially vulnerable to hormonal swings. But the link has not been proved. For ethical reasons, researchers cannot design a medical study that would try to induce depression in someone using a steroid by taking him off the drug.

Medical experts said, however, that there is persuasive anecdotal evidence and a reasonable biological explanation for a connection. When someone takes steroids, the body suppresses its natural production of testosterone. After a person stops, it takes weeks or months to produce normal levels again, leaving some but not all people vulnerable to profound mood changes.

[cs3602001]

Loburt,

I am not too sure of the purpose of your copy and paste, however it really is one of those very subjective views. It was a tragic event, I agree, no one should die like that, especially a young guy in the prime of his life.

When 'abused' roids are a nasty thing, but when used in moderation with the correct advice they can have significant benefits on physical performance with minimal side effects, it is more a case of public ignorance that gives them such a bad name.

But let's just have a quick look at another 'drug' out there and make a quick comparrison:

Youth and Alcohol: A Deadly Mix 

Excessive alcohol consumption causes more than 100,000 deaths annually in the United States.

Alcohol-related car accidents are the number one cause of death for teenagers.

29.5% of teenagers who use alcohol and are of driving age report driving under the influence of alcohol within the previous month. This behavior is more prevalent among males (34.7%) than females (24.2%) and increases with age. Similarly, about one-third of teenagers ride in cars with drivers who have consumed alcohol.

Teenage alcohol consumption is also associated with homicides, suicides, and drownings-- the other three leading causes of death among teenagers.

[TLOS4me]

>> The New York Times

VACAVILLE, Calif <<

*So* glad that the NYT has devoted time and effort to this event. I'd have *never* known about it otherewise, and I live a mere 50 miles away from Vacaville. Guess I spend more time on TF.com than reading about events in my own area.

>> Three and a half weeks later, Mrs. Marrero found Efrain in a bedroom at home, a bullet in his head, a .22-caliber pistol in his hand. <<

Well, happy so far that this isn't turning into an anti-gun thing! Not yet anyways, but if you know the NYT, you know their take on that issue. It is just *implied* merely by mentioning it of course.

OK! OK! So... I'm probably off topic by now, really, I am waiting to see what Bonds, Jose, and the others that are to testify before congress are going to say. Well, actually... I don't give a flying fcuk in a rolling Crispe Cream.

To say that steroid use by pros doesn't impact Joe 6-pack, or his kids, well, what say you season ticket holders? Up 2 U....

[Loburt]

Comparing steroids to drugs such as alcohol is a poor comparison. No one is advocating drinking as a means to improving your performance in sports.

As far as saying the only problem with steroids is that they are abused, the same argument could be made for alcohol and most other substances.

In fact, Keith Richards made the same argument for heroin.

It's not just teenagers that abuse steroids.

Ken Caminiti is the no longer liviing proof of that.

[cs3602001]

Using alcohol was an obvious one and was intended to show the highly subjective views of people who have no real experience in the area of steroids.

As alcohol is a socially acceptable substance people are more likely to advocate its use than that of steroids!!

The comparrison was not intended as side by side, but more to show the lack of awareness for steroids.

The case the newspaper reported sounds like a guy who was using large amounts of synthetic testosterone, probably with long acting esters, inturn witht he continued presence of excessive testosterone the bidy shuts down natural production, not to mention the fact that the body also compensates for the excessive testesterone by producing even more estrogen. So, usually 2 - 4 weeks after the last injection the testosterone crash starts.....the period where the body's test level drop and drop and drop and you can end up in quite a bad emotional state.

However just like alcohol, if people are not educated as to the dangers of a drug and they use it excessively then the end results are very much the same....death.