Isreal :(

[Loburt]

Mod Note

Some of the comments in this thread by member Itamino are not only a violation of the terms and conditions of ThailandFriends, but are contemptible.

Criticizing Israel is one thing. People have a right to do that. Proposing killing millions of people is another. That is hate speech pure and simple. And that is not permitted here.

Sanctions will be forthcoming.

The only settlement that in due time will be dismantled is Israel itself and the time available to go do it is ample. It'll be painful but killing about 10 million people shouldn't be such a big deal given the time available.

6 wasn't enough for the Jews but history is patient and normally about 30% of the population should cut it. With religious bigots as Jews maybe 60%.

[i_love_som_tam]

damn :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: a 5 shocker

[zeusbheld]

oh my...

this thread really has brought out the best in people.

[Loburt]

Arabs themselves are quite a messed up bunch have nothing to offer but to dig out their oil and conquer the whole world with and rest of the world are killing each other for that.

Not a fair comment, Halomi. Every people, every race, has something to offer and contributes something positive to the world.

Denigrating entire races and their cultures isn't the way to broaden understanding and find peace.

People on the other side of this issue should keep that in mind also.

[vbroker]

Civilian casualties are the unfortunate and brutal consequence of war. It has become obvious, however, the Hamas, Jihad Islami, Hezbollah, etc. terrorists are using the expected outrage to their advantage.

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,,19955774-5007220,00.html

No doubt there are those who would call these "Freedom Fighters." This is just plain nonsense.

[robinthehood]

Arabs themselves are quite a messed up bunch have nothing to offer but to dig out their oil and conquer the whole world with and rest of the world are killing each other for that.

Not a fair comment, Halomi. Every people, every race, has something to offer and contributes something positive to the world.

Denigrating entire races and their cultures isn't the way to broaden understanding and find peace.

People on the other side of this issue should keep that in mind also.

But suppose she is essentially correct? It would still be unpalatable but would it ever be alllowed to be accepted as truth?

I dont think so! Which means her view to my mind is no less valid than urs. Both are just persepctives and neither can claim to be right or know best.

Isreal wants a secure border and PEACE

Many of its neighbours want to eleminate it off the face of the earth.

The Isrealis have a democratic and well educated population, Have built a pretty successful country out of a very small population.

Meanwhile the mainly islamic and arab world around them keeps women as second class citizens and is patently backward by comparision with any reasonable standard.

[literacy, health, education... barometers]

The whole problem could be solved in about ten minutes if there was the will on all sides. Sadly that will never happen so on it goes. The Isreali suffer and in turn those around them suffer tenfold for being the source of Isreali concerns.

SOmeday maybe someone will put the arabs wise to the fact that Isreal is never gonna be defeated and for lal the years and efforts to try undermine or weaken Isreal. It is arabs who suffer the most by far by conflicts.

When islam has been marginalized within the world as a political influence and evil force that it is. Then progress can be made, otherwise muslims are doomed to years of disaster and misfortune.

As one writer put it, when we can see an islamic Life of Brian type movie and a similar islamic Monthy Python equalivant then the day will have arrived that sees the Muslim people of the world saved from themselves

[eagle]

Arabs themselves are quite a messed up bunch have nothing to offer but to dig out their oil and conquer the whole world with and rest of the world are killing each other for that.

Not a fair comment, Halomi. Every people, every race, has something to offer and contributes something positive to the world.

Denigrating entire races and their cultures isn't the way to broaden understanding and find peace.

People on the other side of this issue should keep that in mind also.

But suppose she is essentially correct? It would still be unpalatable but would it ever be alllowed to be accepted as truth?

I dont think so! Which means her view to my mind is no less valid than urs. Both are just persepctives and neither can claim to be right or know best.

Isreal wants a secure border and PEACE

Many of its neighbours want to eleminate it off the face of the earth.

The Isrealis have a democratic and well educated population, Have built a pretty successful country out of a very small population.

Meanwhile the mainly islamic and arab world around them keeps women as second class citizens and is patently backward by comparision with any reasonable standard.

[literacy, health, education... barometers]

The whole problem could be solved in about ten minutes if there was the will on all sides. Sadly that will never happen so on it goes. The Isreali suffer and in turn those around them suffer tenfold for being the source of Isreali concerns.

SOmeday maybe someone will put the arabs wise to the fact that Isreal is never gonna be defeated and for lal the years and efforts to try undermine or weaken Isreal. It is arabs who suffer the most by far by conflicts.

When islam has been marginalized within the world as a political influence and evil force that it is. Then progress can be made, otherwise muslims are doomed to years of disaster and misfortune.

As one writer put it, when we can see an islamic Life of Brian type movie and a similar islamic Monthy Python equalivant then the day will have arrived that sees the Muslim people of the world saved from themselves

I've met arabs that didn't deserve to be lumped in as "messed up" so no this isn't essentially correct. Muslims and arabs arn;t all as you see in the media :roll:

[robinthehood]

Arabs themselves are quite a messed up bunch have nothing to offer but to dig out their oil and conquer the whole world with and rest of the world are killing each other for that.

Not a fair comment, Halomi. Every people, every race, has something to offer and contributes something positive to the world.

Denigrating entire races and their cultures isn't the way to broaden understanding and find peace.

People on the other side of this issue should keep that in mind also.

But suppose she is essentially correct? It would still be unpalatable but would it ever be alllowed to be accepted as truth?

I dont think so! Which means her view to my mind is no less valid than urs. Both are just persepctives and neither can claim to be right or know best.

Isreal wants a secure border and PEACE

Many of its neighbours want to eleminate it off the face of the earth.

The Isrealis have a democratic and well educated population, Have built a pretty successful country out of a very small population.

Meanwhile the mainly islamic and arab world around them keeps women as second class citizens and is patently backward by comparision with any reasonable standard.

[literacy, health, education... barometers]

The whole problem could be solved in about ten minutes if there was the will on all sides. Sadly that will never happen so on it goes. The Isreali suffer and in turn those around them suffer tenfold for being the source of Isreali concerns.

SOmeday maybe someone will put the arabs wise to the fact that Isreal is never gonna be defeated and for lal the years and efforts to try undermine or weaken Isreal. It is arabs who suffer the most by far by conflicts.

When islam has been marginalized within the world as a political influence and evil force that it is. Then progress can be made, otherwise muslims are doomed to years of disaster and misfortune.

As one writer put it, when we can see an islamic Life of Brian type movie and a similar islamic Monthy Python equalivant then the day will have arrived that sees the Muslim people of the world saved from themselves

I've met arabs that didn't deserve to be lumped in as "messed up" so no this isn't essentially correct. Muslims and arabs arn;t all as you see in the media :roll:

I agree i have know and lke many great arabs and muslims BUT IN ESSENSE that pales as the DOMINANT AND REAL nature of their culture as it gets expressed and manifests itself in the world is one indeed one of primative backwardness. Just imagine they were not sitting on all thos reserves of oil for the past years etc.

What will be very nteresting is to see how they fare when all the oil and gas does run out. Basically islam has been hijaked all over the world by islamafascists and because in essense the muslim populations of the world tend to be in essense more backward and ill educated and un inlightened the expression of their essense too often makes itself know to the rest of the world with irrational and dangerous acts and idealogies.

The fuss over a bunch of cartoons being but one example= there are so mna more. We need to embrace the muslims who are keen to break free of this awful relgious dogma and pioson while at the same time be prepared to call a spade a spade with the other virulent and evil that is the islamafascists and wipe THEN off the face of the earth. THEN muslims and the rest of us THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE WORLD POPULATION (NON MUSLIMS) can live in peace

[robinthehood]

and why should they accept 95% .... why should they not have 100% ???

classic! thats the problem in a nutshell.

Coz these dumbass ppl cant seem to grasp that it s the palastinan ppl who have suffered the most by far so, as with the partition of Ireland in the early part of the 20th century. Grab what you can. Make peace and develop ur country. All the while ppl are not being killed and all for a miserable 5% of land? Isnt there an incredible abundance of land in the area owned by muslims or arabs?

Hey theres a crazy idea! ow about one or many of these nations chip in together and donate an area amoiunting to that 5 %. Thye could win the bobel prize for peace and COMMON SENSE?

Oh no ur right lets see the killing go on and on all the while the isreali population has grown alot over the years [ppl have to live someolace] and the ratio of isreali deaths to palastinian deaths is absurdly weighted in favour Isreal. It pays to know when ur losing and call it quits.

The enemies of Isreal should have done this a long time ago. Make peace with isreal and get on with their lives. I assure u that had this been done the Isrealis would be quite happy not to be fighting wars or mad terrorists etc

[MikeAussieGuy]

I found this thread very interesting and I've taken a lot of what you guys have posted and made my own mind up.

The thing is I cant watch it anymore on CNN and the BBC, the pictures lately have been horrific, the devastation and loss of life is just terrible.

I dont give a rats ass who is right or wrong anymore, there has to be a better way, this must stop.

[robinthehood]

I found this thread very interesting and I've taken a lot of what you guys have posted and made my own mind up.

The thing is I cant watch it anymore on CNN and the BBC, the pictures lately have been horrific, the devastation and loss of life is just terrible.

I dont give a rats ass who is right or wrong anymore, there has to be a better way, this must stop.

an understandable but emotional response. Stop?? stop what? Tne loss of life?

Sure thing. And then let hizo re-arm and fire more rockets in to Isreal when the moments suits them?

Its tragic but that what happnes when the lunatics in the likes of hezo are allowed t even exsist within a democratic state. If the Lebanese were in full control of their own state without interference from outside then as is the norm the thought of 2 democratic states going to war or resolving their differences with each other would be absurd.

Take even the NI situation over many years. The British and Irish governments were both the legitmate and proper representaives and agents of the respective ppls of each nation and despite often bitter disagreements on many levels with regard to the problems with in the six counties that were and still are part of the UK. The Irish and British governments would nev er have considered any sort of military action against each other, nor would either tolerate a third force [terrorist] as being able to freely amass stockpiles of weapons openly with theiir "sphere of influence" No as democracies both respected each other enough to deal with the differences we had in a civilized manner while both rejecting terrorists. The IRA an dits many offshoots being a threat to our state as much as the UK.

In otherwords the solution for the violence can only come when the hizo are wiped out or rendered impotent

[MikeAussieGuy]

You can pontificate all you like and bring up the last 3,000 years of history relating to such things, I just dont give a ****.

Put your own ass over there and then we will see your comments. Lose your own family and friends and your life then lets see what you have to say. Sure I want Hez wiped out, but you will never convince me this is the way. So dont even bother, the 16 pages so far havent and you sure wont with your biggoted attitude.

[eagle]

You can pontificate all you like and bring up the last 3,000 years of history relating to such things, I just dont give a sh*t.

Put your own ass over there and then we will see your comments. Lose your own family and friends and your life then lets see what you have to say. Sure I want Hez wiped out, but you will never convince me this is the way. So dont even bother, the 16 pages so far havent and you sure wont with your biggoted attitude.

The shame of it is their not seeing that their attitude is bigoted :twisted: Them Arabs them Jews its all BS when it starts with this :roll:

[eagle]

I wonder if anyone has heard Mel Gibson who pushed the movie the Passion on the world got arrested all drunk recently ranting about Jews messing up the world. Knock knock Mel, Jesus was a Jew . Twisted world I tell ya :roll:

[Loburt]

Keep it calm, guys. I know the situation can spark emotions, but attack the post, not the poster.

I don't think Robin has displayed a bigoted attitude. If you want to put a negative spin on his viewpoint, I think it would be more accurate to describe it as callous.

I think just about everyone wants the conflict to stop as quickly as possible.

The Bush Administration, in my opinion, is once again revealing its dangerous approach to foreign affairs by not doing a lot more to bring about a ceasefire first, and a real settlement afterwards.

[eagle]

Keep it calm, guys. I know the situation can spark emotions, but attack the post, not the poster.

I don't think Robin has displayed a bigoted attitude. If you want to put a negative spin on his viewpoint, I think it would be more accurate to describe it as callous.

I think just about everyone wants the conflict to stop as quickly as possible.

The Bush Administration, in my opinion, is once again revealing its dangerous approach to foreign affairs by not doing a lot more to bring about a ceasefire first, and a real settlement afterwards.

I'm wound up about other things but I didn't mean to be attackin, sorry if I was. Your doing an excellent job keeping things on track Loburt .

[mellowman]

I don't know how blind they must be to believe that killing kids and families will get even a single arab joining their fight against Hizbo.

When will these bastards understand that it CAN'T be solved this way?

For every dead Israeli some arab houses destroyed, some arabs killed ...

For every Israeli attack another suicide bomber ...

No respect for killers. Never, NEVER make a difference, between arab terrorists and israeli government sanctioned killings. There IS a difference, I know. But only in WHY they do it. Not in the result.

There is no difference in death. Dead is dead. And the innocent people who are dying are not solving anything, no matter by what reason they died.

Ironically it's worse. Every victim is prolonging the conflict.

Well done world. Keep watching. Keep delivering weapons. It's not your kids under the rubble. After all, Lebanon has no oil, so who cares?

[Cosmo]

I found this thread very interesting and I've taken a lot of what you guys have posted and made my own mind up.

The thing is I cant watch it anymore on CNN and the BBC, the pictures lately have been horrific, the devastation and loss of life is just terrible.

I dont give a rats ass who is right or wrong anymore, there has to be a better way, this must stop.

Agree with you Mike. I can not watch or read anymore of what is happening over there.

It is an unfolding tragedy that is getting worse by the day!!

They must have a ceasefire now and the US must remove itself as the honest broker - it has been totally discredited.

The UN must take over and negotiate a peace between the two sides.

The role of the world including US, Europe, Iran, Syria and other countries should be to back the UN to impose whatever measure it deems fit to bring about peace including imposing ecomonic, military and diplomatic sanctions on both sides.

The killing of the innocents from both sides must stop.

[Loburt]

Part of the problem is finding an honest broker.

The United Nations has not shown itself to be so in many of the conflicts in which it has intervened. Nor has it shown itself to be particularly effective. The massacre at Srebenica is a prime example.

[eagle]

I saw Bush linking this all to Ali quedo again and the need too spread democracy. He said this all while smiling with a born again look in his eyes :shock:

[MikeAussieGuy]

Part of the problem is finding an honest broker.

The United Nations has not shown itself to be so in many of the conflicts in which it has intervened. Nor has it shown itself to be particularly effective. The massacre at Srebenica is a prime example.

Your so right Robert, the UN is toothless when it comes to major conflicts such as you mentioned and so many more particularly Rawanda, where hundreds of thousands of people were slaughtered.

It took a counter attack from a relatively small force of Tutsi's to stop this, if the UN cant match a bunch of Tutsi's they should be dissolved and a new entity established that can.

As a friend of mine who was a secretary in the UN once said, if she ever is reincarnated she wants to come back as UN delegate or official, their lifestyle using our money is simply astonishing.

[mellowman]

The UN must take over and negotiate a peace between the two sides.

The role of the world including US, Europe, Iran, Syria and other countries should be to back the UN to impose whatever measure it deems fit to bring about peace including imposing ecomonic, military and diplomatic sanctions on both sides.

I don't see how anyone could possibly negotiate a ceasefire between two constantly rearmed parties who have the strongest desire to kill each other.

It's like telling a junkie to get clean, while he shouts for the next shot, grabs it and doesn't listen to you at all.

If they don't come up and ask for peace by their own free will, then there WILL BE NO PEACE and no ceasefire. Never.

And sanctions will only hurt the poorest ones (see Iraq) - I can't see the solution in this. Any weapon import sanctions won't hurt Israel, only the Hizbo terrorists, since Israel anticipated this and builds their own stuff.

[chrispilok]

Part of the problem is finding an honest broker.

The United Nations has not shown itself to be so in many of the conflicts in which it has intervened. Nor has it shown itself to be particularly effective. The massacre at Srebenica is a prime example.

Your so right Robert, the UN is toothless when it comes to major conflicts such as you mentioned and so many more particularly Rawanda, where hundreds of thousands of people were slaughtered.

It took a counter attack from a relatively small force of Tutsi's to stop this, if the UN cant match a bunch of Tutsi's they should be dissolved and a new entity established that can.

As a friend of mine who was a secretary in the UN once said, if she ever is reincarnated she wants to come back as UN delegate or official, their lifestyle using our money is simply astonishing.

Yeah. True. I went to school with the children of said officials, albeit many years ago. Unbelievable the benefits they were getting. Like money to fly their whole family home every year. Like low interest loans for housing. One buddy of mine's parents were using those loans to buy houses all over the wolrd: Paris, Spain, New York, Hawai.

Well I hope it's different now.

[mellowman]

Well I hope it's different now.

Nope, it's not, by what I've heard lately. Dunno about the loans but I DO know about abuse of power, money and people inside UN.

[DR_JORDAN]

Who is to blame for this? Certainly not Israel.

I agree with every word of your post. And it doesn't looks like Israel will fold to the UN pressure because the UN is not seen in Israel as an organization that could guarantee the safety of Israeli people; Israel can count only on itself.