sunsnow Posted October 11, 2008 Report Share Posted October 11, 2008 LakeGeneve: the article writer does plead for investigation about the police use of force. I understood his last comment to mean in general that police acted in all legal means when they used tear gas. Now the second thing is definetly what you say that questions regarding was police equipped with right tools and did police use unnecessary force at cases (as well as those in the growds that have been using force against police need to be prosecuted and yea, what the heck blew off those legs!?!?). beej: in all sarcasm, your point is definetly valid! The police is just there watching over the guys legs, not bent over to tie it up or anything. BUT ofcourse, we do not know what is the time frame of that picture, maybe he has just arrived to scene or who knows what... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakeGeneve Posted October 12, 2008 Report Share Posted October 12, 2008 LakeGeneve: the article writer does plead for investigation about the police use of force. I understood his last comment to mean in general that police acted in all legal means when they used tear gas. Yes in general that is also what I understood and I am disagreeing with such a proposition in this case. We all agree on the investigation part so we will have an idea tomorrow with Khunying Pornthips results and in a week or so with the investigation committee. Meanwhile.... UDD GATHER AND PLAN A THREE-DAY RALLY TO COUNTER PAD ANUCHA CHAROENPO AND APINYA WIPATAYOTIN Bkk Post 12/10/08 About 10,000 government supporters joined a United Front for Democracy Against Dictatorship (UDD) gathering yesterday in a prelude to a three-day rally to counter the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD). Former PM's Office minister Jakrapob Penkair joined several key figures from the ruling People Power party at the assembly, held at Muang Thong Thani in Nonthaburi province. The venue was packed with people wearing red shirts. It was the first gathering of government supporters since the Sept 2 clash between the pro- and anti-government camps on Ratchadamnoen Avenue, which left one UDD member dead and more than 40 people from both sides injured. The special session of political talk show Kwam Jing Wan Nee (The Truth Today), hosted by Mr Jakrapob, Jatuporn Phromphan and Nattawut Saikua, was the highlight of yesterday's event. Mr Jakrapob, a key member of the UDD, announced his return to the pro-government movement on the stage after keeping a low profile since he resigned as PM's Office minister in May. "I am back," he said. "I've closely monitored the political situation and have come to the conclusion that we are now living in a society where a prime minister can be punished for hosting a cooking show, while rebels can walk free," he said. Mr Jakrapob said that the UDD would act peacefully and avoid violent confrontations with other groups. Major activities include a three-day rally at Sanam Luang, starting today. The government-run NBT channel will also resume airing Kwam Jing Wan Nee. "I am confident that when people receive the right information, they will no longer support the PAD and will join our mission to protect democracy," said Mr Jakrapob. The UDD leaders yesterday distributed leaflets to the participants, asking them to join the three-day rally to express their opposition to the PAD's demonstration and to purge the demonstrators from Government House, which has been occupied since Aug 26. Many UDD supporters said they would join the rally as they did not agree with the PAD's agenda, especially the planned massive rally in front of the Royal Police Office tomorrow. The PAD demonstration aims at pressuring the police to take responsibility for the Oct 7 clashes between officers and demonstrators that left two people dead and more than 400 injured. "I think the police did the right thing that day," said Akhom Samlitdee, 56, a state enterprise official from Bangkok's Lak Si area. Mr Akhom said the use of tear gas was appropriate to prevent the demonstrators laying siege to parliament. The police had to disperse the protesters, otherwise Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat could not have announced his government policy, he added. "They did not overreact to the incident," he concluded. Krittin Wattanachaiprakij, 51, a hotel worker, said to solve the prolonged political strife, the coup-engineered charter should be amended, as it contains flaws that could lead to more political problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g0mer Posted October 12, 2008 Report Share Posted October 12, 2008 Muang Thong Thani traffic has been insane this weekend with the UDD rallying just outside my condo. Red shirts everywhere.. and posters with WANTED pictures of the PAD leaders all around. I wonder if this is a valid excuse to miss work tomorrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chatty Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 So who would be responsible for 'Culture & Social Morality'? Bcool! hmmm... Is that sarcastic? To be honest, if that's sarcastic it doesn't work for me :roll: And if it's not sarcastic, I would say "Thank you" but I'm not that person. Anyway, I think Culture and Social Morality should run by someone who has high morality and understand in every cultures plus he / she should be a good presentor. How about Ghee? beej? zeus? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soda Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 So who would be responsible for 'Culture & Social Morality'? Bcool! Soda ! ÇêÒÂÂÂÂÂÂÂÂÂÂÂÂ............... :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: PJack PJack PJackkkkk.................................. I'm honored.........but I regret I must decline it...... :shock: :oops: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakeGeneve Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Initial tests results indicate that the Chinese sourced tear gas is able to cause severe injury and loss of limbs! If final results confirm these tests, added with inappropriate and disproportionate use (ie. discharging dozens of rounds when only a few is required), then police operational commanders have some serious questions to answer! Test result shows police tear gas can cause serious harm WASSAYOS NGAMKHAM and THAI NEWS AGENCY - BKK Post 13/10/08 Tests have confirmed that tear gas guns and tear gas grenades, used during the police crackdown on demonstrators on Oct 7, are powerful enough to cause severe injuries, according to a sub-committee on human rights protection under the National Human Rights Commission. Commissioner and sub-committee chairman Surasi Kosolnawin revealed the test results yesterday after observing six types of tear gas being test-fired. The tear gas was made in China, the United States and Spain. The tests were carried out at a football field at the 11th Military Circle grounds. A Chinese-made tear gas canister fired from a shotgun left a crater eight centimetres wide and 3cm deep. A Chinese tear gas grenade was more powerful. One grenade explosion created a crater 16cm wide and 5-8cm deep. Both types of tear gas were used during the clash between police and supporters of the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) on Oct 7. Traces were found at the scene of the clash, Mr Surasi said. The Chinese tear gas grenades made a very loud noise. Its body was white in colour and it looked similar to one featured in media pictures being held by a policeman during the crackdown. Former police forensic science chief Pol Lt-Gen Amporn Jarujinda said the Chinese tear gas grenades were powerful when they exploded. The impact could cause severe wounds and tear limbs off people. Scholars in Chiang Mai are preparing to ask the House committee on police affairs to investigate how police acquired the cheap, low-quality tear gas from China. They suspect irregularities behind the purchase and want to find out whether the weapons, which are dangerous, were tested before use, and why officials shot them directly at demonstrators. The violence on Oct 7 left two people dead and more than 400, including police officers, injured. The violent crackdown to disperse PAD supporters in front of parliament has created public distrust against the Somchai Wongsawat government and the police. Because of the lack of progress in the government's plan to appoint two independent panels to look into the clash, some agencies have begun setting up their own investigation teams. Apart from Mr Surasi's sub-committee, the National Police Office has also set up a panel. The police panel is made up of 14 members led by Chulalongkorn University rector Jesada Saengsupan. It has seven days to complete its investigation, said Immigration Police Bureau chief Pol Lt-Gen Chatchawan Suksomjit. Other members include Pol-Gen Amnuay Petsiri, who is a senator, Ruangchai Sapniran, the deputy managing director of Matichon Co, and Khunying Porntip Rojanasunan, the director of the Central Institute of Forensic Science. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakeGeneve Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 3 interlinked articles. One would hope that the minimum basic and decent thing that the Chief of Police could do is to apologise unreservedly to the family of Angkana for her loss and for the premature allegation from police that she was carrying a bomb which caused her injuries and subsequent death. They may want to take the opportunity to retract other allegations made against others who suffered werious injury pending the conclusion of final invetigations. Human Rights group decries Oct 7 'violence' Bkk Post breaking news 14/10/10 am Thailand's National Human Rights Commission concluded on Monday that violence was used by the police during their operation to disperse the anti-government demonstrators on October 7, according to a commissioner. National Human Rights Commissioner Surasee Kosolnawin, who chaired the agency's fact-finding subcommittee, said evidence collected by the forensic team led by Justice Ministry's Central Institute of Forensic Science director Porntip Rojanasunan showed that violence was used during the clashes. The National Human Rights Commission is meeting Monday afternoon to decide whether to file suit against the country's top law enforcement agency for using excessive force, Ms Surasee said. Khunying Dr Porntip earlier said that tear gas canisters imported from China contained explosive components as wounds found on the body of a dead victim were matched with the size of the Chinese tear gas canisters. She revealed that among the six types of tear gas used in last Tuesday's crowd dispersal, RDX was found in three of them and all were imported from China. RDX is a substance that is used as a major component in many military explosives. Army and police explosives experts on Sunday demonstrated the firing of all six types of tear gas currently possessed by the Thai police, intending to dispel criticism that police had used deadly explosives other than tear gas in breaking up the anti-government demonstrators. Moreover, according to an autopsy of a clash victim, she said, the wounds on dead body had the same size and shape as the cylindrical canisters. Khunying Dr Porntip however said that police who fired tear gas canisters to protesters might not have known that the devices contained explosive components as procurement of the equipment was not clear and the users may also not have known how deadly it was. (TNA) Queen attends slain protester's cremation By The Nation Published on October 14, 2008 Her Majesty the Queen yesterday praised Angkana Radubpanyawoot, who was killed in last Tuesday's violence, as a "good girl" and "protector of the monarchy and the country".HM the Queen presided over the cremation of Angkana, 28, who died when police dispersed anti-government protesters near Parliament. She was accompanied by HRH Princess Chulabhorn Valayalaksana. Army chief General Anupong Paochinda also attended the funeral. Supporters of the People's Alliance for Democracy also showed up to pay their respects to Angkana.Angkana's father, Jinda, told reporters HM the Queen had extended moral support to his family for the loss of his daughter. "HM the Queen told me that Angkana was a good girl, that she had helped protect the country and the monarchy," Jinda told reporters after the cremation.The Queen also said His Majesty the King had been informed of the matter and that donations to the Radubpanyawoot family was HM the King's contribution, Jinda said. Angkana's sister, Daranee, said the Queen told her to take good care of her parents and inquired about the health of her mother, who was in hospital."I told Her Majesty that my mother lost two of her toes in an explosion," she said. "Her Majesty extended her blessings for my mother to recover quickly." Daranee said she could never have imagined HM the Queen would attend her sister's funeral."I was so grateful that I had tears in my eyes. Some of my sister's ashes will be sprinkled on the river near Wat Chonglom, and the rest will be kept at Wat Tuk. Meanwhile, Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat yesterday evening requested an audience with HM the King in Hua Hin. Somchai said he had reported on the present situation to His Majesty. "I am currently not discouraged to continue my work. I will continue my duty as long as I am still in the post." However, he appeared stressed during his short interaction with the media. Chinese canisters to be recalled, destroyedBy The NationPublished on October 14, 2008 The Royal Thai Police will recall all Chinese-made tear-gas canisters that are now blamed for causing injuries and deaths to People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) demonstrators during last Tuesday's clash outside Parliament. The recalled canisters will be destroyed, Ordnance and Quartermaster Division commander Pol Maj-General Phuwadon Wuttakanok said yesterday."The firing test shows that tear-gas canisters supplied by a Chinese company have problems," he said. Phuwadon said the tear-gas canisters had been bought in the wake of the Black May incident in 1992, in which police used bullets and guns to control the crowds. The resulting casualties were huge, prompting officials to look for alternative riot-control equipment. "The government approved the budget to buy tear gas in 1993," Phuwadon said. "The Chinese supplier was chosen because its product was popular back then". After receiving the tear-gas canisters from China, the Ordnance and Quartermaster Division distributed them to a number of police units. "No such canisters were left in our depot. So, I didn't know that such a type of tear-gas equipment existed," Phuwadon said. On October 8, his division conducted a demonstration of tear-gas canisters and the stock did not seem to have the power to blow off people's limbs. However, many PAD demonstrators had lost fingers, toes, arms and legs when police fired tear gas into them the previous day."We then found that in another location there was the other type of tear-gas canister. We therefore collected them for testing. Since seeing that such canisters could injure people, we decided to recall and destroy them," Phuwadon said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joefarang Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 So who would be responsible for 'Culture & Social Morality'? Bcool! Soda ! ÇêÒÂÂÂÂÂÂÂÂÂÂÂÂ............... :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: PJack PJack PJackkkkk.................................. I'm honored.........but I regret I must decline it...... :shock: :oops: siam hotel gets my vote (teamed with a committee of mor lam backing singers) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiamHotel Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 siam hotel gets my vote (teamed with a committee of mor lam backing singers) hehe thx butT n0 thanks...... muahhxx anyway :wink: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakeGeneve Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 siam hotel gets my vote (teamed with a committee of mor lam backing singers) hehe thx butT n0 thanks...... muahhxx anyway :wink: On the appointment or the singers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiamHotel Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 On the appointment or the singers? why, the singH_appointment/x ofF courz 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakeGeneve Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 On the appointment or the singers? why, the singH_appointment/x ofF courz 8) So you'll take the singers anyway then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiamHotel Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 So you'll take the singers anyway then? np Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiamHotel Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 ah: with lo0t of singHa preferably ;! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joefarang Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 btw ... your uniform includes cuban heels, heavy face make-up, a litre of hair gel and to make sure your not mistaken for a thai policeman with all that on, a blue and pink sequinned jacket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakeGeneve Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 So you'll take the singers anyway then? np A shame. I think that they could have really helped. I really appreciate your responses. Maybe no more 'non compisco nenti' from my side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakeGeneve Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Meanwhile back at the 'ranch'......Somchai looks f**ked and the PPP & PP look set to loose a couple of seats each until a new election is conducted. HOUSE DISSOLUTION RUMOURS PPP tense after Somchai's royal audience By The Nation 14/10/10 am Grim and absent-minded on his return from Hua Hin, PM sounds anything but convincing on govt's immediate future Repoters and People Power Party MPs were scrambling Monday night to try to verify claims that Prime Minister Wongsawat might have decided to dissolve Parliament.A grim-looking Somchai was tightlipped upon his return from a royal audience with HM the King in Hua Hin, saying only that he gave the monarch "a normal report on government work like all other prime ministers used to do". When asked if HM the King gave him any advice or encouragement, Somchai said: "I'm afraid I can't talk about that."On a bad day politically for his government, Somchai was also asked how he would proceed with government work now."As long as I'm in this position, I have to keep working. I just can't stay idle," he said.When asked if he felt like giving up, he replied: "Can't do that."He looked tense and absent-minded during the brief talks with reporters. Cabinet secretary Surachai Pooprasert was summoned by Somchai on the prime minister's arrival at the temporary Don Muang office shortly after 8.30 pm. Surachai was seen again after 10 pm but told reporters Somchai summoned him on government budget. PPP insiders said a flurry of phone calls ensued among the ruling party's MPs after the royal audience. "Members of each faction were checking with the more senior MPs and the word House dissolution was one everyone's lips," a source said.Somchai's status became very shaky following the clashes last week between protesters of the People's Alliance for Democracy and the police. Two protesters were killed and hundreds were injured. Her Majesty the Queen, accompanied by HRH Princess Chulabhorn Valayalaksana, attended the funeral of one of the victims, Angkana Radubpanyawoot, Monday evening. The queen described her as a good girl who had good intention to protect the country and monarchy. The big blow for Somchai came earlier in the day when results of a primary scientific probe were announced showing Angkana and other victims suffered from impact of China-made tear gas fired by police.The police earlier claimed the victims might have been killed or wounded by explosives they or fellow protesters were carrying. Both Somchai and the police have later said they regretted the casualties, but stopped short of apologizing for the bloodshed.Somchai left the Don Muang office around 11 pm. EC seeks red card against PPP MP, yellow cards against 1 PPP MP, 2 Puea Pandin MPs, 1 senator The Nation 14/10/10 The Election Commission has resolved to ask the Supreme Court to give a red card to a People Power Party MP, and four yellow cards to another PPP MP and two Puea Pandin Party MPs as well as a senator.EC commissioner Praphan Naikowit said the EC decided to ask the court to disqualify Prasit Wutthinanchai, a PPP MP for Chiang Mai for alleged vote buying and lift his election right as well as taking criminal action against him. The three MPs the EC decided to have the court disqualify their victories are Julaphan Amornwiwat, another PPP MP from Chiang Mai's Constituency 3 and two Puea Pandin MPs from Pattani - Wimuktar Waba and Yusari Suzalor. The EC also seeks to disqualify Nakhon Phanom Senator Witthaya Inala.Unlike Prasit, the three MPs and the senator would be allowed to contest sub-sequent by-elections if the court agrees with the EC's proposal to annul their victories.They are suspected of having illegally persuaded voters to vote for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakeGeneve Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 Khun Chai (House speaker) has announced that parliament has been cancelled today and has requested PAD to facilitate and opening later this week. All seems fairly civil thus far with all parties seemingly being disciplined but let's see if it lasts through the day (especially if the DAAD turns up). The invitation by the police yesterday for international & national observers to attend todays protest was a good move in terms of transparency and accountability. Reportedly, 4 granades were launched from the river towards ASTV on Pra Athit early this morning at about 3:30am with thankfully no injuries. Sounds like a bizarre Pirates style inspired idea. Still waiting for the results of the Oct 7 investigations....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GM Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 Calling themselves the Peoples Alliance for Democracy is quite ironic given that the solutions they are presenting are anything but democratic. Creating an elitist commitee to appoint political positions??? wow.. :shock: :shock: :shock: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loburt Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 Let's see, under the system the country has basically had for the past decade or so, a bunch of super rich provincial barons and godfathers (the cabinet), who have bought their way into power, direct a bunch of bought off super rich provincial barons and godfathers (the senate) on who to appoint to "independent agencies" that are supposed to serve as watchdogs on government to see that no one is corrupting the system. Did someone say something about elites and democracy? wow.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GM Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 So it seems nothing will change... just the people controlling the power.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loburt Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 I don't what, if anything will change, but this is certainly more a battle between competing groups of elites supported by different segments of the population than "the elite" against the "the people". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grezzzy_greer Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 The biggest difficulty for people overseas is to understand that here it is NOT the same as in a country where the people are well informed and well educated. It is sad but true that even the average people in many up-country areas - people who are educated - only get the information that the government wants to give them. They suffer from this lack of information, and it makes it virtually impossible to make an informed decision abou who to vote for. Those who lack education are even worse off and may only get a very small portion of the entire story when needing info on who is the best candidate for their area - it is often based on who pays the most to the village and/or the head-man, as you can see from the number of convictions for vote buying and electoral fraud. I admit that two wrongs don't make a right, but Thailand can't operate in the same way as other democracies at present simply because the electorate doesn't have access to all the information - so by default it cannot be the same until the masses are educated - and sadly, that will not happen any time soon, despite everyone's efforts. In the meantime it appears that we have to have some better form of selection - whatever that may be - to appoint the government - I too am uncomfortable with the thought of a committee to do this, but it's going to be up to the Thai's as to what they decide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJack Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 The biggest difficulty for people overseas is to understand that here it is NOT the same as in a country where the people are well informed and well educated. It is sad but true that even the average people in many up-country areas - people who are educated - only get the information that the government wants to give them. They suffer from this lack of information, and it makes it virtually impossible to make an informed decision abou who to vote for. Those who lack education are even worse off and may only get a very small portion of the entire story when needing info on who is the best candidate for their area - it is often based on who pays the most to the village and/or the head-man, as you can see from the number of convictions for vote buying and electoral fraud. I admit that two wrongs don't make a right, but Thailand can't operate in the same way as other democracies at present simply because the electorate doesn't have access to all the information - so by default it cannot be the same until the masses are educated - and sadly, that will not happen any time soon, despite everyone's efforts. In the meantime it appears that we have to have some better form of selection - whatever that may be - to appoint the government - I too am uncomfortable with the thought of a committee to do this, but it's going to be up to the Thai's as to what they decide. in a word: peasants Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunsnow Posted November 24, 2008 Report Share Posted November 24, 2008 We need to develop communication lines outside Bangkok. Currently outside Bangkok people do not have access to radio, tv, newspapers or let alone to internet. So all they can do is to listen to the village big bosses instead of using any of those other methods that currently still not have reached even the outer skirts of Bangkok. Maybe one laptop per child program should be extened here too. I heard also that even in rural India villages use mobile phones and mobile intenet these days. It is so big shame that that kind of options seem to be lacking here according to some punters who write here.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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