beej Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Its still going on! Cambodian PM asks Thai troops to withdraw from border area in 24 hours PHNOM PENH: -- Cambodian Prime Minister Hun Sen here Monday asked Thailand to evacuate its 81 troops from the Veal Intry area near the Preah Vihear Temple on Cambodian soil within 24 hours, and warned war otherwise. On Monday, the Cambodian authority said a "large-scale" armed conflict may happen, if the Thai troops fail to be withdrawn from the border area near the ancient temple of Preah Vihear immediately. Wonder if the Thai army has got any of that dodgy police tear gas, might come in handy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeeMarc Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 maybe they're looking to start a war to unite the thai people against a common enemy!! I would bet its got more to do with this than anything else.... "war is peace", "Ignorance is strength" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave40 Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 war is peace", All we are saying is "Give Peace a Chance"!!!!! :idea: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJack Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Its still going on! Cambodian PM asks Thai troops to withdraw from border area in 24 hours PHNOM PENH: -- Cambodian Prime Minister Hun Sen here Monday asked Thailand to evacuate its 81 troops from the Veal Intry area near the Preah Vihear Temple on Cambodian soil within 24 hours, and warned war otherwise. On Monday, the Cambodian authority said a "large-scale" armed conflict may happen, if the Thai troops fail to be withdrawn from the border area near the ancient temple of Preah Vihear immediately. Wonder if the Thai army has got any of that dodgy police tear gas, might come in handy! Hun Sen is a thug. And he is not afraid to order military around. Plus he has the added advantage of a past with the Khmer Rouge. I sure hope the Thai military dont take the bait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnie Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 I still don?t understand what happen with my people. We lost the temple to Cambodian decades ago. No one seems to care about it before, until UNICIFF listed the temple as world heritage than we get greedy and want it back. (don?t throw stones at me yet Thai people).I have seen those forward mails trying to convince people about how we lost the land and others will take our land away and bla bla bla. Then many people went crazy because they afraid that those neighbours countries will take Thailand and cut it in pieces. What were they thinking!!!!!!! Before anyone gets me wrong, I love Thailand no less than any other Thai. But think about it, some innocent people will be killed just because of a building? Build a new temple and make it grander then the one we lost, how about that!!! God bless Thailand please. We really need that. I'm not and never will throw stones at you kha. I do understand what you are trying to say kha. I myself also don?t understand what happen with people here. New problem happening every single day.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyP Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 I would say Cambodia is planning to capitalise on a severley weakened Thai political system. It is no secret that there is no real love lost between the two nations, especially when you name your second largest city (and host of one of the worlds wonders) in celebration of the defeat of your neighbour. I would imagine there are a few Cambodian hierachy sitting with a smug smile! The word CONFLICT is starting to become synonomous with the word THAILAND throughout the world press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chatty Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 I still don?t understand what happen with my people. We lost the temple to Cambodian decades ago. No one seems to care about it before, until UNICIFF listed the temple as world heritage than we get greedy and want it back. (don?t throw stones at me yet Thai people).I have seen those forward mails trying to convince people about how we lost the land and others will take our land away and bla bla bla. Then many people went crazy because they afraid that those neighbours countries will take Thailand and cut it in pieces. What were they thinking!!!!!!! Before anyone gets me wrong, I love Thailand no less than any other Thai. But think about it, some innocent people will be killed just because of a building? Build a new temple and make it grander then the one we lost, how about that!!! God bless Thailand please. We really need that. Understand how you feel p'Nicky, i'm still confuse about the information that i have got. If it's just a temple I don't think Thai people think so much about it but it's about the land that we own it before, and it's about pride, I think. I read some newspaper long time ago that Cambodia tried to claim that another temple belongs to them, I'm not sure this temple is included of this issue. Someone said they are trying to take land along the borderline 200,000 km. Whatever, I'm still in BKK why should I care? right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeeMarc Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 ... it's about pride, I think. and Thai ego. and all logic, common sense and 'jai yen yen' goes out the window when these are in jeopardy. :roll: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chatty Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 p'Nicky, the another temple called Prasart Tamuentom. It was on the news, I'm not sure which one... it was pink frame, should be Daily News, not sure jing jing. but we will see what will happen soon. And it will show the gut of this gov. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stramash Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 I agree that it does seem a distraction tactic to take Thailand's mind off its own civil unrest problems by diverting attention elsewhere. I just hope that the government dont see an escalation of this problem as a solution to its other problems - would be like putting band aid over gaping wound... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beej Posted October 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 This ''other'' temple thing could be a rumor to rouse some more hatred for the Cambodians, making it more acceptable if/when things kick off. This land was lost years ago, let it go, let Cambodia have another world heritage site and stop crying that you didn't get your own little Angkor Wat. Wasn't this all started when the PAD kicked off at the PPP and people needed to see some action.......... even though no action was needed it was all just a political stunt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
English_Bob Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Just read the news.... a Cambodian General claims that war has been averted because Thai troops have withdrawn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
English_Bob Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Oh wait... hold the front page. A Thai spokesperson said Thai troops have NOT withdrawn from the disputed territories. - Anyone got GPS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeeMarc Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 It?s not about My or Mine temples or whatever it is. that peace, just wish for it!!!! (hopefully)It?s not only temples it?s about the land and power of army to protect your own country. Thailand already done and help Cambodia as a refugee camp, as a good neighbor all Thai we always knew well that one day we will be as that horse in âÀª¹ÕÂêҴ¡ in Cambodia cases. Looking at USA you will ever never surrender to any other countries that overrun to any of your borderlines. it?s not only about that ?legacy? belong to whom or whose. Sorry what I just said..itchy!!!! so, if Thailand will never, ever surrender to any other countries that overrun your borderline (like US you say) why didnt Thailand do something years ago, instead of ignoring the issue then, when the Temple and the land it sits on was in dispute, and by doing so, allowed it then to be part of Cambodia? Why now? The real truth of this is in the motives now, not in the actions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beej Posted October 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 It?s not about My or Mine temples or whatever it is. that peace, just wish for it!!!! (hopefully)It?s not only temples it?s about the land and power of army to protect your own country. Thailand already done and help Cambodia as a refugee camp, as a good neighbor all Thai we always knew well that one day we will be as that horse in âÀª¹ÕÂêҴ¡ in Cambodia cases. Looking at USA you will ever never surrender to any other countries that overrun to any of your borderlines. it?s not only about that ?legacy? belong to whom or whose. Sorry what I just said..itchy!!!! The only reason this is kicking off is because of internal Thai politics. More people dead because of those tossers you vote for, sad that they are using their people like pawns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeeMarc Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 It?s not about My or Mine temples or whatever it is. that peace, just wish for it!!!! (hopefully)It?s not only temples it?s about the land and power of army to protect your own country. Thailand already done and help Cambodia as a refugee camp, as a good neighbor all Thai we always knew well that one day we will be as that horse in âÀª¹ÕÂêҴ¡ in Cambodia cases. Looking at USA you will ever never surrender to any other countries that overrun to any of your borderlines. it?s not only about that ?legacy? belong to whom or whose. Sorry what I just said..itchy!!!! The only reason this is kicking off is because of internal Thai politics. More people dead because of those tossers you vote for, sad that they are using their people like pawns. if i was a betting man, thats where my money would be too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeeMarc Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 PeeMarc: We done and your country voted for us that time in international court wasn?t?i could be wrong, but i dont think your government at the time even bothered with the issue at that time, and the court gave it to cambodia, hence the problem now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIEBE Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 I still don?t understand what happen with my people. We lost the temple to Cambodian decades ago.. So far as I know the Temple never belongs to Thailand so Thais didn' t loose anything. Only the surounding area is a part of Thailand (parking area, entrance, phone booth?). The Temple was build in the Khmer Empire. The Khmer Empire occupied the most if not 99% of what we call Thailand today. Therefore the Temple belongs to Thailand like Angkor Wat. So they should make a model again and place it in a temple somewhere There wasn' t a problem with it till the PAD played the nationalistic card and started to brainwash ppl that Cambodia is evil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeeMarc Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 I still don?t understand what happen with my people. We lost the temple to Cambodian decades ago. sometimes we forget that half the world is below average intelligence. But this same half usually makes the most noise and is the most easily manipulated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunsnow Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 General comment: Hehe, yea, it is funny how actually there are Thais (NOT meaning Pandorea but some people I have personally talked with) who do not realise that most of their most famous temples are built by Khmers and heck, even the written script and language is actually Khmer origin than "Thai"...or that "Thais" are actually south-Chinese or...and so on...it is really revealing to read history that is NOT written by those who have agenda to change it. (LIEBE: without wanting to put words in Pandoreas mouth, I do think she meant that in the recent 100 year history sense that even by those terms it is Cambodian, let alone in the more longer historical sense...actually now that I read your quote of Pandorea and your text once more, I think you also just wanted to agree and add to Pandoreas message ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakeGeneve Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 PeeMarc: We done and your country voted for us that time in international court wasn?t?i could be wrong, but i dont think your government at the time even bothered with the issue at that time, and the court gave it to cambodia, hence the problem now Marc, your correct. The thai govt accepted the ICJ ruling at the time even though they could have ignored it (not good for international relations as and very rarely done. Decisions of the World Court rely on the goodwill of the parties in each case). Previous Thai govts and the current govt accepts that the temple is in Cambodia. So people talking about the temple is moot as it is the undemarcated border which is the issue. The temple now has been accorded WH status so it is for all to enjoy. There is reportedly 20 areas, including maritime areas, along the Thai & Cambodian border which require demarcation, the area surrounding Preah Vihear is but one of them. The Joint Border Commission (established in 2000) has been deferring the next mtg for the last few months. Previous govts have been dragging their feet on the issue of progressing demarcation. I count at least 3 other temple locations where thai and cambodians troops are in close proximity to each other. There have been 3 exchanges of fire in the last month at various locations along the border, all involving injury of some kind (see reports in the Thailand v Cambodia thread in Politics). Two thai soldiers were seriously wounded from a landmine just 10 days ago near Veal Intry (one lost both legs the other one leg). This was very concerning as it meant that possibily new landmines had been laid in the area which would be unlawful; or that previous demining was not certified correctly. Hun Sen is raising the heat here due to the alleged provocative actions of thai soldiers (I don't doubt that both sides are playing games). He wants to take the border issue to the ICJ and use the UNSC to lodge a complaint against thailand. It is an advantageous time for him given the state of thai politics. Whilst it may be a temporary reprieve for the thai govt by having a foreign bogey, I would have thought that this issue is a loser for them ultimately given the misguided perception that thailand somehow 'lost' the temple or has lost territory to Cambodia. So many stupid rumours going around about huge land claims or aspirations by cambodia. Maybe it is a winner for a beleagured govt about to fall - I don't know. We should perhaps not forget the thai military has their own agenda. Hopefully, sanity will prevail and troops are withdrawn to a distant location. There is no compelling need to have thai or cambodian troops close together. Given the histrorical context it is a dangerous game both are playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeeMarc Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Hehe, yea, it is funny how actually there are Thais (NOT meaning Pandorea but some people I have personally talked with) who do not realise that most of their most famous temples are built by Khmers and heck, even the written script and language is actually Khmer origin than "Thai"...or that "Thais" are actually south-Chinese or...and so on...it is really revealing to read history that is NOT written by those who have agenda to change it. ALL history is written with some sort of agenda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stramash Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Hehe, yea, it is funny how actually there are Thais (NOT meaning Pandorea but some people I have personally talked with) who do not realise that most of their most famous temples are built by Khmers and heck, even the written script and language is actually Khmer origin than "Thai"...or that "Thais" are actually south-Chinese or...and so on...it is really revealing to read history that is NOT written by those who have agenda to change it. ALL history is written with some sort of agenda. Especially the weighty tome; 'A history of agendas through the ages' by Professor Norbert de Jong... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunsnow Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Yea I know, but there is agendas, Agendas, AGENDAS and Thai-AGENDAS (in this case)... Sure there is historical things (or views of history) that are more truthful than some others. The education system for example was in 1950s in Thailand shaped to support Thainationalistic views by the ruling generals ideology. Hence you got now generations of Thais who think that some of their temples are "Thai", or "Siamese", or that, god forbid, for example Angor Wat is made by some glorious Thai rulers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakeGeneve Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 A quick reminder of the Peace Park proposal from some academics (and based on the recent chilean-peruvian coastal dispute precedent). It can either be a temp or permanent resolution. Thailand and Cambodia both agree to defer or withdraw their claims on the 4sq kms of undemarcated land north of Preah Vihear. The disputed land is then designated as a Peace Park, either jointly managed or managed by a third party such as a UN body. They then move on from this flashpoint and hopefully work on some of the other 20 odd areas along the border needing demarcation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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